Track 240Z

[Throttleton]

I am making a lot of panels for people and a full shell build also...which is great and glad to be off help but I keep looking at my plastic shell covered in dust in the corner with not much happening. The chances of me getting a road car built any time soon are slim to say the least so my mate Stephen suggested making my shell into a track car, loads faster than building a road car and at least I would be getting a drive of the thing. I could then take my time building a road car just how I want it but having some fun with the track car.
So the reason for this post and hopefully a build thread is.... I may know my stuff with frp stuff but I am no expert on the 240 mechanicals. I know how to pull it all to bits and put it all together properly but thats about it.
I am planning on using stock everything for the car at the start to see what it feels like to drive. All mechanicals will be restored to the best of my ability and funds built with a full kit of plastic bushes all round, other than that stock.
As I do the build I am hoping Z club members will comment on things I really need to change over stock to avoid any weak link problems I don,t know about.
My first question is... My engine was running fine years ago when it was taken out off the car (15 years!!). I have squirted oil down the plug holes twice a year and turned the crank by hand a few times as well. Apart from oil is there somethings I need to do before I put it in the car start and destroy it??
Any suggestions over anything will be much appreciated.
Ta.
Craig

 

[260ZG]

As the engine is out of the car I would do the following.

Head off and check pistons/bores visually. Clean up head and replace valve stem seals which have probably gone hard and brittle and clean up and grind in valves.

Clean Carbs out thoroughly and check for corrosion in float chambers etc

Sump off, good clean out and possibly drop a big end and check condition. Clean out whatever oil ways I could get at clean out sump pan and oil pickup strainer,

Take off timing cover and check timing chain and tensioner for condition and replace if required. (making sure to get it timed up correctly!)

Check water pump and replace if required

Remove oil pump check. clean and replace if required and carefully re-fit.

Check and clean distributor and alternator Change fan belt as it is likely to be cracked.

Generally do a spanner check on all bolts inc flywheel. Replace any missing manifold studs, and clean up threads on studs and nuts

Depending on the engines history I would possibly fit new rings, mains and big end shells (inc new bolts?)

This may sound like a lot of work but with the engine out of the car is much easier to do, so should not take that long, and once the engine is back in the car it can stay there

I am sure there are a couple of things I have forgotten but no doubt someone will point out what I've missed

I would also run engine for a short while and then change the oil and maybe use a flushing oil depending on how grotty the sump contents etc are.

Edit
I am assuming that a gasket set and seals are still available........

 

[rallymanDP]

Interesting project,Craig, and of course, good luck with the build.

I'm not sure that it will be a lot quicker to do a Track Car than a Road Car, mind you - I can't easily see where you can save time & money, except on the trim & cosmetics. Everything else has to work just the same, indeed, even better than the standard stuff. And I think that most Track Day operators require a current MOT on all vehicles, but might be wrong on this one.

Most important to start with, though, is did you make a Chassis or Spaceframe to hang the Panels onto, and is it designed to accept the OE suspension & Mechanicals, etc. ? That will determine the answer to your questions.

As far as the Engine goes, it is 10 to 1 that it will need a new Head Gasket pretty soon after startup - they seem to corrode quickly when stored in whatever conditions. Otherwise, just fit a new Water Pump and check the Bores for Rust while the head is off.

Hell, why don't we do this for you down here - we can do a deal for some of your excellent FRP Panels !

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Right now you are talking!

If all goes well your experiences will enable you to build track-proven shells/frames.

Standard 240Z mechanicals will be ok to start with. Just get it running reliably and safely. Then each time out you will discover which bits need development. Good standard suspension and brakes will cope ok at first (lower it a bit though).

It will be your shell where the development will be needed first of all. These cars have been proven over millions of miles and across the world.

As I said at Zedfest, if I wasn't so attached to my car I would be interested in a reshell.

Good luck

 

[Throttleton]

Blimey Colin, Thanks for the input! That sounds like the sort of info I need if I was building a track car..........and you are right of course...but I want to put my car together and have a few shots on the track just to have a drive of the thing. I don't want to at present try and make it into any sort of competitive racer it's just I drove it when I was a kid and have not driven it since then and I am now 42!!
So just to get it mobile and sit in it will be a day to remember for me and my 6yr old boy.
I know you and others will shoot me down for the compromise but if I could get it round a track even for a lap it would mean the world to me. Once done then yeah all the stuff you have kindly mentioned would be on the cards.
Duncan, thanks for the kind words, Stephen has mentioned you can get a track day without an MOT which hopefully is the case!
The frp shell is the same as the oe one with regards to suspension and mechanicals and the subframe the same for engine mounts etc. I can bolt the lot on and be more than happy with the structure of it all so no probs there.
Like I said if I can get the car built and useable for a few days out it would be awesome then while I am having a bit of fun with it I can build a fancy c/f affair or whatever and pick your brains over a proper build.
I will get some pics up as we go.
Cheers
Craig
PS Might take you up on your offer Duncan!!

 

[Throttleton]

Thanks Rob, the safety issue is something I have gone overboard on so I am happy in that respect.
What I like about your car is that it is competitive along side other cars who have spent much more to get to the same level. I am sure you will say it is down to your driving skills (ha ha). but I get the feeling a well set up 240 in a mildly modified state will be a handfull for even the more powerfull 240's around the track....but what do I know...

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Craig a mildly modified 240Z is a great car - they were a superb design. My car is reasonably quick because it is well behaved and gives you confidence, not because of my driving - my lads are as quick in it. 'Racer' is quicker than me in it!

It just works, I think I'm lucky that I haven't spent a fortune on parts that have taken me down the wrong road.

One of your shells could either be fantastic or worse than a standard car - so lets find out

 

[ray100]

Hi Craig,
Some quality advice above,what about adding replacing the core plugs while you're at it? Someone once told me ages ago that using automatic transmission fluid is a great way of flushing out all the oil ways,not tried it myself so maybe others could chirp in with their opinions.
Keep the thread going with plenty of pictures,should be a good read.

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Craig, one thing I would do is to build 'adjustability' into your suspension mounting points if you can.

With your car not being a Nissan shell it may not be exactly the same measurements. Also even with a Nissan shell we want to change the car to handle better on track. So can you build 'camber' plates into the 4 top strut mountings. With your shells it will be easier at the front (metal) than the back (FG) I reckon.

 

[Throttleton]

Cheers ray 100 will take that on board.
How have you adjusted the camber on yours Rob? I can't really do anything to the plastic shell other than make some shims up to sit on top off the struts. Another predicament I have is spring rating and length. With the stock springs even at 40yrs old ,the car will hardly compress them at all. If I use the same rating but a shorter spring I fear my back will snap. The same length spring but softer sounds horrible as well. I suppose I need to build the car with its full weight of parts on then try and measure each corner weight?? Then ask on here peoples gestimations for the springs.
Rob your point about it being either fantastic or worse than a steel car on the track is part of the reason I want to keep it as stock as possible at the start so you can judge it solely on the shell and chassis. Be good if it was at a track where club members can have a go and voice there opinions.

 

[Nigel Brook]

So what's the weight of the shell ?

 

[ben240z]

Hi Craig,If I can be of help or if you need a roll cage then give me a call.
07766547871
ben

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Craig, a bit of inspiration for you. By the way that rear wing is like the one I mentioned at Zedfest. Others have seen this video but I think you joined after we raved about it.

Z-Car Racing Team Montain Race 2005 - YouTube

Currently my camber has been adjusted by crudely 'slotting' the top mount holes in the body. I have some camber plates to weld it to do the job properly when I fit my new wings.

Springs - don't worry about that yet just get the car running and see how hight it sits with everything in and fuel. Standard springs may not be too far out re stiffness but might be too high.

 

[Throttleton]

Nigel the shell is about 115 kilos.
Thanks Ben will give you a ring nearer the time.
Great Vid Rob, I see what you mean about the rear wing, shame the driver slamed his brakes on before that left hander, he might as well have given the car a fighting chance and turned left!!

 

[STEVE BURNS]

Nigel the shell is about 115 kilos.
Thanks Ben will give you a ring nearer the time.
Great Vid Rob, I see what you mean about the rear wing, shame the driver slamed his brakes on before that left hander, he might as well have given the car a fighting chance and turned left!!

its back out racing again

 

[moggy240]

great idea to turn it into a track car,no doubt it will get a lot of interest when you get it done

 

[Throttleton]

Couple more pics Rob, Difficult to see as the f/g covers it but the roof perimeter and down the windscreen pillars are 20mm steel tube with a 5mm wall thickness.

The rear strut top is heavily laid up with multiaxial glass. The layers of glass from high load areas can be tapered down to areas of less load. fibreglass has that advantage over steel in that respect.

 

[tel240z]

Is there a steel layer in that top mount area or is it underneath?

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Craig, I really need to see this shell 'in the flesh' but to be honest it seems a long way off being a replacement for a Datsun metal shell. I'm sure I'm not telling you anything you don't know. There is so much work to do.

You are doing the right thing and trying it out as a trackday car first. However I'll be honest and say that flat-out on track I'd rather me and my lads were in my metal car with full roll-cage than yours. I need convincing that the shell is strong. I fully understand that my car is not as strong as the day Datsun built it but I'm reassured by the cage being professionaly fitted to metal sills and wheel arches.

If your car was more of a kitcar design i.e. full metal chassis and roll-cage with Datsun 'lookalike' non-stressed body it would be more acceptable to me at the moment

I'm not knocking what you are doing but just probably saying what others might be thinking. I know that you want a monocoque body like some of the Lotus cars and the early 60s Elite for example is a fine car, with very little metal in the body.

Just sharing my thoughts with you Craig - you are able to take constructive criticism I reckon. As a matter of interest do cars like the Reliant Scimitar GTE (with chassis) have any metal in the body, especially the roof pillars?

I bet you are dying to prove me wrong

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Just so you know, my first 'car' was a Reliant 3 wheeler at the age of 16.

It didn't handle well and I was a young lad with a motorsport hobby. My parents must have worried every time I went out in it - I didn't even have to take a driving test (MC Licence).