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- Thread starter AliK
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SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
So, a potential 400 club members w/out getting into Z32s and onwards ?
And no reason why they, like Gaz can't join - in fact one doesn't need to be an owner to join.....although some here will be multi-car owners so perhaps 400 is very optimistic......that might mean that 250 paid-up members is almost the max possible and that the club is in fact quite healty and representaing the majority of the 20 year cars now !
And no reason why they, like Gaz can't join - in fact one doesn't need to be an owner to join.....although some here will be multi-car owners so perhaps 400 is very optimistic......that might mean that 250 paid-up members is almost the max possible and that the club is in fact quite healty and representaing the majority of the 20 year cars now !
johnymd
Club Member
I think Rob got it wrong about S30 numbers falling. I have never seen any data to indicate this and have always believed the numbers go up every year or have done ever since I owned my first one back in the late 80's. But anyway, I'm doing what I just moaned about and drifting off the topic.
richiep
Club Member
Not surprising as they weren't sold here. That data won't catch the handful around. Also will be missing the NISSAN S30 Fairlady Zs.
John, Sean I didn't say S30 numbers were falling, I think Z numbers in general but I'll try to quantify that.
The problem I have is that we don't keep stats for Website members.
S30 is the strength of the Club, however all are welcome and encouraged.
Sean is your Webmaster a Club member or outside resource?
This was the situation when I wrote the minutes for the 2007 AGM:
Membership Report: Total members currently 423 (last year 450)
Breakdown of membership numbers to car ownership:
2005 2006
240Z 102 113
260Z 75 81
280ZX 46 52
Z31 28 24
Z32 61 94
350Z 13 13
Just done a quick check and there are 109 Z Club members with 240Zs. So I have 2, John has about 5 etc so we may have about 125 belonging to Z Club members.
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SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
This is what I've seen quoted re numbers falling :
As Rob says, he didn't mention S30s - I did because I believe that they're increasing and taking up the slack left off by other decreases.
But the membership quote 423 and not 250 ? I'm confused but at 450, post Z31s count for 25% - that's pretty good and worth holding onto ie catering for !
We were 3x on our committee, now 4x :
President (Chairman), press and events
Treasurer/shop//m-ship 'ie all the money) and events (also runs the forum and site)
Secretary and producer newsletter, shop goodies
New Press contact to take off my load but I'll be his assistant
All are moderators automatically (whether active in that role or not).
In addition, there are 3x non-committee moderators (but full-club members) so it's not just 'the big 4x who are seen the 'see all - be all'......and yes, I've been moderated too
- part of the democratic process - no-one is above anyone else despite their role !
Great idea to jump-start the conversation! Putting it in general has certainly increased the participation, it does feel a little like airing our dirty laundry in public though
There's been a lot of good suggestions already!
From me:
Website & Forum
It feels very unloved at the moment, old fashioned and not maintained. Good content is hidden and useful posts seem to disappear into the archives. I'm also surprised that there is talk of a need to support the site and forum. I'm pretty sure that a small site and forum like this could be hosted somewhere for free these days if needed. Moderation needs to be improved as threads routinely wander off-course or devolve into slanging matches. I have personally felt loathe to post on some threads because of the posting behaviour of some members. Good round-the-clock moderation is difficult so I doubt this one is an easy fix.
Why join?
As others have said, at the moment there doesn't seem to be a reason to join the club apart from a) being able to edit forum posts and b) the welcome pack. I don't think that the offering is strong enough to entice new members at the moment.
Online it would be nice if once you became a member there was a big archive of guides and info, databases of the cars and members online to access. I'm personally not that interested in a newsletter, but I think that everything that should be in one should be published as editorial on the website.
Offline, as a new member it was a little disappointing to see another club representing the Z's at a classic car show (NEC), especially as stands at shows is something that the club used to do. I've been a member for a few months but I'm still not sure when any local or national club meets are happening - if they're actually happening, they should be more visible as I'm sure any new member would like to see evidence of an active club.
Identity
There should be a conversation about how we want the club to be perceived from the outside and by new members. I agree with Sean that ZClub's site and members should be the first port of call for anyone remotely interested in Zs and the motoring press. The club obviously has a lot of history and we need to show it to people so they want to become part of it. At the moment I don't feel like the website does that.
Classifieds
I have no problem with traders on the site / forums and they shouldn't have to support the rest of the membership, given the difficulty in obtaining parts it should be made as easy as possible for both members and traders to advertise anything they have for sale/trade. Having this open to the general public might increase timewasters but isn't any chance at that elusive part worth it?
Just my $0.02
There's been a lot of good suggestions already!
From me:
Website & Forum
It feels very unloved at the moment, old fashioned and not maintained. Good content is hidden and useful posts seem to disappear into the archives. I'm also surprised that there is talk of a need to support the site and forum. I'm pretty sure that a small site and forum like this could be hosted somewhere for free these days if needed. Moderation needs to be improved as threads routinely wander off-course or devolve into slanging matches. I have personally felt loathe to post on some threads because of the posting behaviour of some members. Good round-the-clock moderation is difficult so I doubt this one is an easy fix.
Why join?
As others have said, at the moment there doesn't seem to be a reason to join the club apart from a) being able to edit forum posts and b) the welcome pack. I don't think that the offering is strong enough to entice new members at the moment.
Online it would be nice if once you became a member there was a big archive of guides and info, databases of the cars and members online to access. I'm personally not that interested in a newsletter, but I think that everything that should be in one should be published as editorial on the website.
Offline, as a new member it was a little disappointing to see another club representing the Z's at a classic car show (NEC), especially as stands at shows is something that the club used to do. I've been a member for a few months but I'm still not sure when any local or national club meets are happening - if they're actually happening, they should be more visible as I'm sure any new member would like to see evidence of an active club.
Identity
There should be a conversation about how we want the club to be perceived from the outside and by new members. I agree with Sean that ZClub's site and members should be the first port of call for anyone remotely interested in Zs and the motoring press. The club obviously has a lot of history and we need to show it to people so they want to become part of it. At the moment I don't feel like the website does that.
Classifieds
I have no problem with traders on the site / forums and they shouldn't have to support the rest of the membership, given the difficulty in obtaining parts it should be made as easy as possible for both members and traders to advertise anything they have for sale/trade. Having this open to the general public might increase timewasters but isn't any chance at that elusive part worth it?
Just my $0.02
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SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
Great idea to jump-start the conversation! Putting it in general has certainly increased the participation, it does feel a little like airing our dirty laundry in public though
Website & Forum
It feels very unloved at the moment, old fashioned and not maintained. Good content is hidden and useful posts seem to disappear into the archives. I'm also surprised that there is talk of a need to support the site and forum. I'm pretty sure that a small site and forum like this could be hosted somewhere for free these days if needed.
I have no problem with traders on the site / forums and they shouldn't have to support the rest of the membership, given the difficulty in obtaining parts it should be made as easy as possible for both members and traders to advertise anything they have for sale/trade. Having this open to the general public might increase timewasters but isn't any chance at that elusive part worth it?
If the thread here was in the members-only section so as not to wash the laundry in public, there'd be no website-member input which I feel is just as important as anyone else's.
This might also be perceived by 'the public' as very constructive - looking in the mirror, warts 'n all - can't move on if we don't question ourselves.
As a trader, I'd be happy to pay per annum but I'd want to see the club more proactive in promoting the make and attracting members. I think the trader's forum is good but needs a spring clean to make current traders more visible and an ideal place to see other 'sponsors' offering paid-up members some real discounts.
I think that the m-ship fee could increase to £20 BUT, a sstated by Mr Tenno - there has to be something 'tangible' for any fee.
Mags are hard work and cost money - so do indoor shows....which also cost manpower !
Our forum and sites cost less than £150 a year with the latest Vbulletin for mobile phone and tablets presentation and a VERY big database storage !
Not free 'cos free means adverts and sh*t and not up to date software, limited storage and back up but not 'break the bank' either !
Great idea to jump-start the conversation! Putting it in general has certainly increased the participation, it does feel a little like airing our dirty laundry in public though
There's been a lot of good suggestions already!
From me:
Website & Forum
It feels very unloved at the moment, old fashioned and not maintained. Good content is hidden and useful posts seem to disappear into the archives. I'm also surprised that there is talk of a need to support the site and forum. I'm pretty sure that a small site and forum like this could be hosted somewhere for free these days if needed. Moderation needs to be improved as threads routinely wander off-course or devolve into slanging matches. I have personally felt loathe to post on some threads because of the posting behaviour of some members. Good round-the-clock moderation is difficult so I doubt this one is an easy fix.
Why join?
As others have said, at the moment there doesn't seem to be a reason to join the club apart from a) being able to edit forum posts and b) the welcome pack. I don't think that the offering is strong enough to entice new members at the moment.
Online it would be nice if once you became a member there was a big archive of guides and info, databases of the cars and members online to access. I'm personally not that interested in a newsletter, but I think that everything that should be in one should be published as editorial on the website.
Offline, as a new member it was a little disappointing to see another club representing the Z's at a classic car show (NEC), especially as stands at shows is something that the club used to do. I've been a member for a few months but I'm still not sure when any local or national club meets are happening - if they're actually happening, they should be more visible as I'm sure any new member would like to see evidence of an active club.
Identity
There should be a conversation about how we want the club to be perceived from the outside and by new members. I agree with Sean that ZClub's site and members should be the first port of call for anyone remotely interested in Zs and the motoring press. The club obviously has a lot of history and we need to show it to people so they want to become part of. At the moment I don't feel like the website does that.
Classifieds
I have no problem with traders on the site / forums and they shouldn't have to support the rest of the membership, given the difficulty in obtaining parts it should be made as easy as possible for both members and traders to advertise anything they have for sale/trade. Having this open to the general public might increase timewasters but isn't any chance at that elusive part worth it?
Just my $0.02
Good contribution.
SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
Ali.......there have been many comments, ideas, propositions and some repetition - please can you summarise it so far with perhaps some 'actions to be taken'* against each item or group of items (ex a web manager would probably suffice as 'action' for a few items.
*certainly does NOT mean that said action will or should happen but juts so that there is a visibility of what each item will incur !
*certainly does NOT mean that said action will or should happen but juts so that there is a visibility of what each item will incur !
SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
I'll finally add for this weekend that :
out of no disrepect to the engine modderso), swappers, enhanced inductors and without us all becomming detail anoraks for OEM cars, the club should highlight (at least to the outside world) an appreciation for stock cars (not stock-cars ) to avoid the 'Jap-tuning' image so often seen and not actively encouraging everyone to mod their cars for max-power.
Whilst offering the advice and the site containing 'how-tos' for those optimising their Zs !
out of no disrepect to the engine modders
o), swappers, enhanced inductors and without us all becomming detail anoraks for OEM cars, the club should highlight (at least to the outside world) an appreciation for stock cars (not stock-cars ) to avoid the 'Jap-tuning' image so often seen and not actively encouraging everyone to mod their cars for max-power.Whilst offering the advice and the site containing 'how-tos' for those optimising their Zs !
IMO :-
Relative newcomers to the Z scene primarily want the following :-
1) Advise on how to tackle jobs and fix their car.
Much of this is in the archives but hard to track down as topics sometimes meander from one thing to another.
2)Identify parts that are needed and where are the places to get them (eg DaveP recently found doorcards from Thailand which he shared with us).
3)Identify what are good mods and how to go about doing them
Again, much of this is scattered about the archives
4)Maybe encouraging those undertaking rebuilds to share their progress on the site
(This is a general comment and not just a "Don" focused comment, just to clarify)
5)Maybe the opportunity to meet up in regional get togethers
Recognise that there are "senior" members who have been in the Z scene for many years. For my points 1 to 3 listed above they have "been there, done that" so they are probably interested in getting different things from the club than the "newbies"
My 2p worth
Relative newcomers to the Z scene primarily want the following :-
1) Advise on how to tackle jobs and fix their car.
Much of this is in the archives but hard to track down as topics sometimes meander from one thing to another.
2)Identify parts that are needed and where are the places to get them (eg DaveP recently found doorcards from Thailand which he shared with us).
3)Identify what are good mods and how to go about doing them
Again, much of this is scattered about the archives
4)Maybe encouraging those undertaking rebuilds to share their progress on the site
(This is a general comment and not just a "Don" focused comment, just to clarify)
5)Maybe the opportunity to meet up in regional get togethers
Recognise that there are "senior" members who have been in the Z scene for many years. For my points 1 to 3 listed above they have "been there, done that" so they are probably interested in getting different things from the club than the "newbies"
My 2p worth
bluejon
Club Member
A bit late to this one, but you guys have flagged a number of points I would have made. I came to this place about a year ago, and soon after willingly paid a membership fee in recognition of the value the site provides. And I will continue to renew on that basis.
I'm a member of another club/forum that went through a similar process of soul-searching not too long ago ... the same issues of website design /functionality, what is membership, and governance of the club, a lot of which were falling out from the underlying key issues of keeping the tech/site fresh and up todate, and the same for the club concept itself and how it is run.
Magazine? meh. point had been made I think that that is outdated. What we all value is the site, the expertise and experience. To this end the site and forum need a shake up. Too many dead ends, broken links etc. Shop ... where? Classifieds spread in more than one place, technical stuff is all over they place. Members section ... hmmm. And the search functionality doesn't help that much. It's not an easy place to like.
I agree the point on club meets - two per year is ideal. Supplemented by local metres ad hoc.
For most people there club boils down to just two things ... the site /forum, and meeting others.
Membership is a good idea ... people like to do this, and as I say the value of free advice far exceeds a small annual fee, but nice too if this is recognised with a few basic goodies. It's not necessary, but it is easy to do. The membership pack at present is, well, effectively nothing..
I'm a member of another club/forum that went through a similar process of soul-searching not too long ago ... the same issues of website design /functionality, what is membership, and governance of the club, a lot of which were falling out from the underlying key issues of keeping the tech/site fresh and up todate, and the same for the club concept itself and how it is run.
Magazine? meh. point had been made I think that that is outdated. What we all value is the site, the expertise and experience. To this end the site and forum need a shake up. Too many dead ends, broken links etc. Shop ... where? Classifieds spread in more than one place, technical stuff is all over they place. Members section ... hmmm. And the search functionality doesn't help that much. It's not an easy place to like.
I agree the point on club meets - two per year is ideal. Supplemented by local metres ad hoc.
For most people there club boils down to just two things ... the site /forum, and meeting others.
Membership is a good idea ... people like to do this, and as I say the value of free advice far exceeds a small annual fee, but nice too if this is recognised with a few basic goodies. It's not necessary, but it is easy to do. The membership pack at present is, well, effectively nothing..
Arkwright
Inactive
As the person responsible for putting the membership pack together what do you call a few basic goodies?
Not so long ago I was always asking for suggestions and my requests always fell on deaf ears with the exception of stupid suggestions. In that respect I gave up. I am always looking for stuff to fill the envelope. Time was when I used an a4 size envelope which contained quite a few things. However as you will have noticed postage prices have increased. The price of promotional goods has increased but membership prices remain the same. Believe it or not the current pack costs £3.50 (give or take a few pence). To add just a key ring now would put it up by about £4. not much left for the club from your tenner.
I am not criticising you for the suggestion, merely pointing out the costs involved and I would welcome any suggestions for improving the pack.
Maybe we should increase the membership fee?
What concerns me is the number of black members. What prevents you from joining and contributing to the running of the club you obviously enjoy?
Not so long ago I was always asking for suggestions and my requests always fell on deaf ears with the exception of stupid suggestions. In that respect I gave up. I am always looking for stuff to fill the envelope. Time was when I used an a4 size envelope which contained quite a few things. However as you will have noticed postage prices have increased. The price of promotional goods has increased but membership prices remain the same. Believe it or not the current pack costs £3.50 (give or take a few pence). To add just a key ring now would put it up by about £4. not much left for the club from your tenner.
I am not criticising you for the suggestion, merely pointing out the costs involved and I would welcome any suggestions for improving the pack.
Maybe we should increase the membership fee?
What concerns me is the number of black members. What prevents you from joining and contributing to the running of the club you obviously enjoy?
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Arkwright
Inactive
With regard to my last paragraph I have just checked the list of 'Members' attending Japfest in April. I see that a couple of Black members have signed up. Without naming names I wonder why they feel it is OK to take advantage of the clubs discounted entry fees but not be members of the club.
I don't really expect a reply to this nor do I expect them to fail to join in on the day but I will be waiting to see if they turn from Black to Red and support the club they are taking advantage of.
I don't really expect a reply to this nor do I expect them to fail to join in on the day but I will be waiting to see if they turn from Black to Red and support the club they are taking advantage of.
SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
Extra money for the club - reduce the m-ship pack to zero cost or almost by having sponsors supply what trinkets are deemed fit..question : what would you supply an overseas paid-up member - tax-disc holder
?The paid-up m-ship (even at £20*) should be justifiable by :
unlimited access to this improved site and database
members discounts from parts/services suppliers
reduced event ticket pricesf
free club insurance evaluation
perhaps also list one's car in a club-record registry in case of vehicle theft
updated classifieds system for direct advertising to specific buyers
Other less 'tangible' benefits :
camaraderie (able to get in touch with other local owners) between fellow members
part of a club - belonging
ability to aid others, share experiences and participate at club events
ability to apply oneself, construct something with the Z community
Send out by email a pdf club membership 'card' - avoids the postal charges.
Send out a m-ship pack each end of year with a club calender and annual review (newsletter), again - to keep postal costs to a minimum.
*use the money for incentives for people to help on stands, participate in projects (prices, trophies etc maybe vouchers against trader's products/services pre-negociated so that they cost the club nothing ?
Sorry Ali - I was provoked
chrisvega
Well-Known Forum User
Read and digest the valuable and informative above posts from Mr.Tenno, nospark and bluejon you'll go a long way to getting an answer to your question. Great posts from the aforementioned, well put guys
and represents thoughts of silent majority I am sure
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SeanDezart
Well-Known Forum User
....and this is how I started my club-life back in '89 (there are still some on here who'll testify to that) :
http://zclub.net/forum/showthread.php?t=26650
Bravo to you.
http://zclub.net/forum/showthread.php?t=26650
Bravo to you.