Trackdays, a worrying trend....discuss

All the Motorsport Vision tracks are 95db
Donnington often have loud days, which is ridiculous given that it's next to East Midlands airport
Most drive by tests that I've seen are on the start finish straights and just backing off should be enough to keep them happy.
A bike style baffle fixed to the tailpipe would kill a load of noise, and not spoil the day interms of power.
 
Matt Long said:
All the Motorsport Vision tracks are 95db
Donnington often have loud days, which is ridiculous given that it's next to East Midlands airport
Most drive by tests that I've seen are on the start finish straights and just backing off should be enough to keep them happy.
A bike style baffle fixed to the tailpipe would kill a load of noise, and not spoil the day interms of power.
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Donington are allowed 104 "noisy days" a year but if you look at the typical sites like book a track etc. there are very few that are practical as these days are spread evenly between cars, bikes and test days, leaving perhaps a handful that can be driven.

Backing off the throttle at key points can be dangerous (snap or lift off oversteer etc.) and is kind of counterproductive to the very essence of what a track day and my car is all about, I know one of the microphones is on the start finish straight but it’s one more thing to have to deal with whilst driving at over 100 mph in a 40 year old car.

As for a tailpipe addition, any decently tuned car has been setup with the exhaust system as is, any length or flow addition will change that state of tune, in some cases significantly.
 
For those who enjoy or who plan to experience track-days, take care when booking up, the trend is now that "acceptable" noise levels are being dramatically reduced to around 98db on a fair number of available days on a number of major tracks e.g. Donington and Mallory park to name but two. Many aerodrome circuits such as Bedford etc. have limit way less than this (87.5 drive by) IMHO most of our modified cars will fail this.
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All the Motorsport Vision tracks are 95db
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There are loads of track days with higher limits..


http://www.cadwellpark.co.uk/trackd...Day=trk&trackTime=day&submit.x=25&submit.y=12
 
Ali, I'm sure the guy who measured the level on your Z at Castle Coombe didn't know what he was doing. I heard your car that weekend and no way would it have hit 104db if measured correctly. The meter should be at a 45deg angle from the pipe, 1m away from the tailpipe and the car has to be in an OPEN SPACE, a very important factor. A decent db meter also has a switch so it can measures the low frequencies and this can make quite a big difference to the reading if the audio has quite a bit of bottom end content, Being a sound engineer & musician I own a few db meters and often carry one in my Z just in case I should get pulled for being a noisey ******, so far I haven't had the need to use it.
Those of you who've heard my Z know it's bloody loud(normally), but I have a little trick up my sleeve if I need to hush things up. My Z came with a Supertrapp muffler fitted, not everyone's choice for a Z I know, but the pipe can be tweaked quite a bit level wise with the use of a ring system on the end of the pipe. It takes me a couple of minutes to go from mega loud to perfectly sane levels and anywhere in between.
http://8903e7f0897f2982f439-51d6683c30d3fc51d493ee4745c5d29a.r14.cf2.rackcdn.com/uploaded/5/0e546591_5-x-19-sc-elite640x480.jpg
II'll bring a db meter to Japfest so that we can check our cars before taking to the track, but you'll still need to figure a way of quietening down your car if you're over the level limit.
 
Jake, funnily enough I did think about your car when this Thread was started.

It would be interesting to get the levels before and after fitting the device. How much does it affect performance ?
 
Look forward to that Jake! It'd be interesting to get an informed view from a professional sound engineer.

And yes your car definitely has a throat on her when on song!!! My youngest son loves watching that video over and over on my phone ;)

@Rob - while I see why people may argue that point, it doesn't stand to critical reasoning: for example air travel is essential to our economy and business health etc so why are people complaining about the noise at Heathrow?

When I bought my first house in Windsor many years ago, I accepted the fact that there will be flights going over my house at low altitude from 05:00 to 22:00 ish, the local race course will regularly jam up the road at weekends and the flood of tourists every holiday season will make the area busy. It's just a given trait of the area you buy in. But then again, some people buy houses with unrealistic expectations of the surrounding area or making adequate risk assessment or have expectations that a growing population will have zero effect on their lives or local services for that matter; be it super markets, health centres or race tracks.

If the race track was built on greenfield land then absolutely right that they should complain about the noise. Or even if track events were happening at odd hours of the evening / morning then fair enough.
 
Hi Jake
I'm an engineer some folks even call me "sound" so I guess that makes me a "sound engineer" as well
I have several Db meters and have taken them to track days, the general response from marshals being
"Great thanks but ours is right and f you don't like it then ....."
They have moderate training but little understanding of the science behind sound in particular "noise"
 
smileyinside said:
@Rob - while I see why people may argue that point, it doesn't stand to critical reasoning: for example air travel is essential to our economy and business health etc so why are people complaining about the noise at Heathrow?
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Yes it does - people complain about anything if it affects them adversely, it's up to police, government and councils etc to take a balanced view and control things.

For info:

Noise
The external noise emitted by passenger cars has been controlled since 1929 when the Motor Cars (Excessive Noise) regulations were introduced. New cars are now required to meet Europe-wide noise limits. These have been progressively reduced from 82 decibels (dB (A)) in 1978 to the current limit of 74 dB (A) established in 1996. This means it would take 7 new vehicles to make the same amount of noise as one vehicle that just meets the pre-1978 limits. Information on the level of noise recorded for new models of cars at their type approval test is also listed in the data table.

When looking at this information please note that off-road vehicles are allowed to be 1dB (A) louder, as are direct-injection diesels. These allowances are cumulative, so the limit for an off-road vehicle with a direct injection diesel engine is 76 dB (A).

The noise levels quoted above are the maximum levels that are permitted for new vehicle types. Many vehicles produce lower levels of noise, and it is illegal to modify the exhaust system of a vehicle to make it noisier than the level recorded for that model at type approval.

A new EU regulation is being introduced from July 2016, Regulation (EU) No 540/2014, which will phase in tighter noise limits over 10 years, together with a revised, more representative test procedure. By 2026 the limit for most new passenger cars will be 68 dB(A).

I like the noise my blue 240Z makes and I'm really disappointed with the noise my 370Z makes however I'm sure my neighbours prefer the 370Z. My standard 240Z is also very quiet.

The noisy cars around me are irritating, unnecessary and give car enthusiasts a bad name.

At the end of the day there is no point in arguing about sports car noise and actually our noisy cars shouldn't be that noisy on the road never mind on a race-track. I know I'll come across as a grumpy old man again but as you get older you can see other viewpoints as well as your own. When I was much younger I used to compete in night rallies on a Saturday night, with the public on the road and thought it was my right to do so and why did we have objections from miserable sods. Later I helped organise them and that was tough!

Tyre noise will be next.
 
I was referring to the fact that it only effects the small number of us that attend the tracks. It would be nice to see more make full use of their zeds but that's just not going to happen so I've given up trying to encourage people to join me and Dean on track days so I don't post when We go to Brands.
 
johnymd said:
I was referring to the fact that it only effects the small number of us that attend the tracks. It would be nice to see more make full use of their zeds but that's just not going to happen so I've given up trying to encourage people to join me and Dean on track days so I don't post when We go to Brands.
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It doesn't mean they're not having full use, just not track day type use:)
 
Im not that fussed about taking my car on the track, mainly because i dont want to hack it round all day, i dont think the car would thank me if i did! and you cant seem to get insurance for a half day, and at around £100 for a day it's not great value for money.

However i would like to see some Zeds on the track at Brands and speak to other owners about the ins and outs of track days, and would be more than happy to turn up even though im not going to be driving :)
 
Rob Gaskin said:
Jake, funnily enough I did think about your car when this Thread was started.
It would be interesting to get the levels before and after fitting the device. How much does it affect performance ?
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Rob, I won't get a chance now for a few months to give you some db level tests with & without the pipe rings fitted as yesterday I took her to her winter residence where she'll get some new goodies & lots of tlc ready for April. Soon as she comes out to play again I'll run some tests. As far as performance goes I can't give you any figures, but the car seems to have more torque lower down with 6 rings fitted(didn't run any when you heard it). I went with 6 as that gave me a loud but not silly loud. I have 12 rings in all to play with.

Ali, The car has just been featured on an album by a band called BushFieldSmith and is even credited on the sleeve notes :)

SKiddell, Yeah I'm sure they wouldn't really be interested in our opinions but it can't hurt to note how they do things and measure that against how we would measure the sound levels. Could be useful information ;)


 
OK. I'll let you both know when we are next at Brands (usually evenings).

As I say, I'm not trying to encourage people to go on track anymore. It's all personal choice and I know it doesn't suit everyone.
 
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