Good thing too.

zero tolerance..............and IF you happen to be taking medication that could have given you a tadge mesaurement - prove that you have a prescription, otherwise, it could just be medicine that is all signalled "could cause drowsiness" with a symbol very clear which should be avoided when driving and/or operating tools/machinery !

zero tolerance !
 
I'm on the other side of the fence,

I believe everyone should take responsibility for their own actions, if I have three pints but feel that I'm still in control then I think that's ok, if I have half a pint but don't feel safe then I shouldn't drive.

Nanny state, if you make it zero tolerance on alcohol then it'll just mean they'll start thinking of what to ban next.

And those who do get drunk and injure someone should have huge penalties. We're supposed to be all intelligent adults, why not think for yourself?
 
Russ said:
I believe everyone should take responsibility for their own actions, if I have three pints but feel that I'm still in control then I think that's ok, if I have half a pint but don't feel safe then I shouldn't drive.

Nanny state, if you make it zero tolerance on alcohol then it'll just mean they'll start thinking of what to ban next.

And those who do get drunk and injure someone should have huge penalties. We're supposed to be all intelligent adults, why not think for yourself?
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Problem is Russ, the more one drinks, the safer one THINKS one is - it's like 3-beer women and 10-beer women.................:cheers:

I once drove home (in Holland) from the other side of town, some small roads than one exit worth on a m-way after an evening of wargames and smoking cannabis (I was in my grennie Z) and I've never scared myself so much in a Z before and I was driving slowly and carefully.

If you're responsable, don't drink and drive - no-one's banning it, just get pissed and let someone sober drive you and others home, making it safer for you, them and the other responsable people on the roads.

I never knew my maternal grandfather, he was safely driving home and a 12t lorry came off the m-way, straight onto one of those 3-lane roads and found someone overtaking solmeone slower - he was in a rush so he overtook the overtaker.......result - he ploughed straight into my gramps and 'miraculously' (great term that) didn't kill him outright - he lasted on for several painful hours.
The lorry driver was still pissed from the night before and had had one or two for the road that afternoon. He was fined and given a suspended sentence - turned out he needed his licence to work and provide for HIS family.

Be responsable - zero tolerence.:bow:
 
I disagree, I don't suffer from thinking I'm a better driver having had a few. There also times and places, if you lived in a rural area then taking it steady on the country roads late at night isn't really the same as driving through a busy city with pedestrians around.

I do know that I'm a better driver after two pints than my housemate who is tired 5am in the morning, or the people that pay zero attention, or the people who's eyesight has degraded over the years but have done nothing about it, or those who do 50 on the motorway tailgating a lorry.

I don't think there is a clear cut rule, if you have zero alcohol tolerance then I want the same for smoking, having a phone in the car, having children who talk, any possible slight liability needs to suffer the same draconian measures.

I say make people accountable and reponsible for their own actions. Every year we have less responsiblity for ourselves thanks to nannying, and every year as a population we become less responsible! It's no bodies fault, ever, always the government at fault for not controlling us enough. Where does it all end??
 
Russ said:
I say make people accountable and reponsible for their own actions. Every year we have less responsiblity for ourselves thanks to nannying, and every year as a population we become less responsible! It's no bodies fault, ever, always the government at fault for not controlling us enough. Where does it all end??
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If you don't have a law against something, how can you punish those who are irresponsable ?

Responsability is respecting others, not necessarily the law !

And if you want to stop the nanny state, you're about 15 years too late my friend.

Catch 22 :

People don't respect others so make a law making it a crime not to so as to enforce them to resepct others. Result, resepct is a legal obligation and not a moral one.....final result - no morals, just do what you can do until caught..............like drinking and driving.:driving:
 
Never too late, never give up! Why should my generation put up with all the previous generations bad decisions!?

Apathy spoils this (and most) other countries, I'm not doing that.

I say law as a guidance, and let the public decide on more individual basis. I've no idea how this could work, but my experience in court (as the jury) was excellent and I really felt part of it. I'd happily do one hour a week helping to decide if someone caught having had two pints was doing any harm, and was the guy on his mobile who killed someone on a bike more in the wrong than someone who did no harm...

I respect (most) people and try to live a peaceful life, but I always get screwed by laws, royal mail lost my road tax, cost me £60 in a fine for not displaying, yet I've never not had road tax. Yet others can do the same, no licence, and all sorts of other crap and pay the same fine?

That's not justice :)
 
I am sorry but I am in agreement with Sean. As far as drink/drug/tiredness driving goes there are far far too many irresponsible people out there who do it and cause untold accidents. I totally recognise that there should be an element of taking responsibility for your own actions but alcohol and drugs for example impair your judgement. Tiredness again is another that is a big issue but thats such a difficult one to enforce. The nanny state is here and unfortunatly it has lead to a large proportion of people to think that no matter what they do they are not accountable as the government should do it instead. This leads to lazy ignorant and "not bothered" attitudes that basically make things worse for us. If we were made more accountable for our actions and punished accordingly and the legal system was geared up for it then perhaps maybe things would be different. However its not. The law seems to let the victims down more and more these days and the aggressor can always seem to find someway of deflecting the blame somewhat.

As Sean said there is no respect for others these days. Most often the attitude is one of I'm alright Jack and blow anyone else. If we did have more of an awareness of those around us we wouldn't need to have stupid laws that limit what we do and when, just so we can keep the minority in check. Until then we are stuck with having to be draconian in the way the leagal and police system acts.
 
I'm in agreement really, I sometimes overshoot when defending my side of things :)

I don't know how we ever get back to a better system though, we need a revolution or some awesome government, neither of which will happen... maybe?
 
I was shocked recently to learn of dustbin inspectors who check that your bins are not out too early or too late, not over-filled and not stuffed with items that should be re-cycled.

I don't believe that a Con. govt. would change much as it appears that everyone is OBSESSED over there with BEING SEEN to be doing "the right thing" !

Going back to dustbins......I remember us putting ours out the morning and taking them in when coming home after work - WHY do you need such inspectors who then act as judge and jury and give you a fine if not as should be ? Is it a ploy to keep Britain fully employed ?

Russ - I love our little discussions - don't change.

If you can't change it and you can't be bothered to be apathetic, leave the country....................
 
Anybody they catch drink driving should be taken to the side of the road and clubbed to death in my opinion :smash:.

I don't drink never have never will :D.

Oh and once you've run out of drinkers to kill you can start on the bloody smokers, Because they're a right bunch on thoughtless w@nkers to :unsure:.

How to win friends and influence people Rob stylee ;):lol::lol::lol::lol:.




Rob
 
Back to the drink driving.

Zero tolerance is very hard to achieve.

I work for the underground and we have zero tolerance on drink and drugs, which is fine. You should see the list of stuff we are not allowed to take because it contains alchol or codein. From mouth wash to cough medicine etc etc.

I believe that people who kill whilst drink driving should be done for manslaughter however because there is no excuse. I do believe that most drink drivers are serial drink drivers, they basically do it because they think they won't get caught, and when they do they get a slap on the wrist , can get there ban reduced by going to lessons, and will then more than likely be doing it again before or after they get there licence back. A house mate of mine once got done for driving home from the pub that was a 5 min walk away, why drive.

Thtas my rant over anyway.

Darrell
 
So what can cough mixture give you ? What % in the blood ? Either place an incredibly low figure which will just cover occasional medicine or do what I suggested earlier - zero tolerance and if caught AND you have a legitimate reason to be taking medication that does just raise you over the threshhold - prove it.
 
Great discussion. As with most things if it's done in moderation that is normally sufficient to avoid problems.

I went to see my Dad today and also to bury my Mum's ashes. I then drove him out to a country pub for lunch. My Dad was a Cooper (barrel maker) for many years and used to beer taste in his profession in later years at Bass, Burton. He is also a HUGE motoring enthusiast by the way.

I had one pint of beer (4.6 %) and he had one and a half (he has a drink every lunchtime at 88 years of age). If I had had an orange juice it wouldn't have been the same day. If I had had 3 pints and an accident on the way home I would never have forgiven myself!

Russ, when you have had 3 or 4 pints you are not in a position to determine your ability to drive (I know from experience) but I think zero tolerance is going a bit too far.
 
I don't drink when going to the pub but if I went to a bbq I'd have 1 or 2 cans to swill it down.
I agree with Rob & Russ that zero tolerance is going a bit far.
Drivers are still swaying about or tossing on the phone AND going through red lights, so they might pose a greater risk to road safety than someone who has had 2 or 3 pints.
Quite often on a Saturday night I have a very large Bacardi at home and sometimes I feel as though I could drive and others definitely not.
 
We all have our own opinion of zero tollerance in drink drive cases. At one time or another most of us have thought we are better drivers when we've had a drink, some of us unfortunately finding out the hard way that this is not so.
I was a traffic cop for most of my police service, some of it prior to the current drink drive laws (breathalyser) being introduced. I also 'volunteered' to be a dummy in the many medical tests that took place prior to and following its introduction (there's a lot to be said for being 20-something and as much beer as you can drink paid for by the Home Office).
However, whichever way you look at it you can't beat walking up a dark road carrying a severed head or a leg to join the rest of its body in an ambulance, to hold the hand of a dying woman or share a last fag with a trapped lorry driver (when you don't smoke). The real cream on the cake is knocking at someones door and telling them their son, daughter, husband, wife has been killed and then taking them to the mortuary. All because some tosser drank too much and then drove. Then you have the pleasure of interviewing him and telling him that it really was his fault and he shouldn't drink and drive. But of course, deep down, he knows better.
In many cases the law is strong enough to deal with the person who blows positive for a minor traffic infringement but in the circumstances above it never was and it's only in recent years (since I retired) that a more serious view is being taken - hence zero tollerance.
 
Up here in sunny Jockland their is a real problem with drink drivers, And the lack of police effort in catching them, I live in a small town in the countryside and drive a Taxi most Saturday night in Inverurie a slightly bigger town, And I see a hell of a lot of drunk farmers driving home from the pubs and clubs with what appears to be total impunity.

I don't see why people think they have any right to get behind the wheel of a motor car after having any drink at all, If you drive then you drink nothing end of story. What's the point of one pint ? it's a total waste of time.

If you can't go out and not drink they you have a real problem in my opinion, I did drink when I was a young lad, Not a lot but I have had few heavy nights out but never drove when I had been drinking, And once I started driving mobile cranes for a living I gave it up all together because they don't mix.

I'd support a zero tolerance law on drink driving 100% and ban people who do for life no second chances.



Rob
 
Following on from one of the earlier comments, I to work for the railway. The drink drive limit is 80mg of alcohol per 100ml of blood.

My company limit is 30. If you are tested either randomly or in connection to an incident and you have more than this within your body then there is a good chance that you will be out of a job after the disciplinary proceedings are through.

I think its fairly obvious from the above on which side of the fence I sit with regards drink driving!

As an additional note, my dad has been in the recovery business for a long time, as has much of my family on my dad's side. The number of things that I have seen and heard are such that there is absolutely no justification for drinking and driving above the current limit.
 
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