Should I develop an interest for Z's?

[JonC]

Hello all, new to the forum but not new to restoring rustbuckets, I've cured a few tinworm infestations in my time.

My question is really about availability of parts for restoration of 240z and 260z.
Where the bodywork is not going to show I'm not shy about fabricating the repairs I need out of sheet metal, but I'm no master craftsman in this regard so usually where significant outer body metalwork is required I need to be able to buy at least repair sections.

I see that Dragon Auto in the USA supplies some panels for these cars, and some parts appear available in the UK, although how reliable this supply is I can't guess.

Someone either encourage me or discourage me from getting involved with Z cars in the first place, reassure me that panels are available for all problem areas in the £200-£300 price bracket.

Also is there any shortage of particular mechanical parts?

Thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Quick reply:

Yes please get involved in Z ownership - they are fantastic cars.

Don't buy a rustbucket - the cost of panels make it hard to justify the work. Import from the USA or find a well restored UK car.

Have a good search around the Forum - it's all been said before.

Good Luck, Rob (Membership Sec)

First move - Join the Club

 

[JonC]

I'll be carefully assessing any car that I buy and would expect it to take me (part time) about 2 years to get it on the road and 2 more years to get it how I want it. I am acutely aware that restorations are not a money spinner, having worked mostly on 60's British cars which are often worth next to nothing even once restored, (granted the parts are more available and cheaper but the cost of restoration is still many thousands.)

The whole idea is restoration so I don't want an already restored car, US import is pretty unattractive as it'll need converting and will then always be a conversion job.

Are you saying that Z's are uniquely difficult to restore for some reason? I know the shape is full of complex curves, this is why I'm asking about panel availability.

 

[Huw]

Hi

I can only speak for the 280ZX; they are pretty straight forward in terms of body repair. Having restored many MG’s, Mini’s, and the odd Humber, Z car construction is less peculiar than British cars of the same era. The compound curves in most panels are no worse to deal with. Give it a go, the cars are far more fun to drive anyway!

 

[JonC]

Thanks Huw.
Where do you get your parts from? Are they generally cut off of breakers or is there a reliable british manufacturer/distributor of panels? What's the quality/fit like?

Humber restoration sounds like a real labour of love.

 

[Mr.F]

Nissan OEM panels still reasonably available:

Front wings
Headlamp cowls
Bonnet

Readily available repair panels:

Sills for coupe
Wheel arch / sill return for coupe
Rear lower corner for coupe (maybe)
Floors and underfloor chassis
Front chassis repair sections
Radiator support panel
Rear panel (3-piece repair)

I have a contact for a wider range of panels that I could put you in touch with for:

Lower door skins / door floors
Tailgate rear skin repair and shut face and corner repairs
Rear panel upper (slam panel)
Rear lower valence
Sill returns as a separate piece (for 2+2 as well)
They may also still be prepared to do bonnet hinge repair panels and whole door skins, but both are much more difficult to reproduce.

Mechanically there is not much that is unavailable (apart from front and rear whole suspension arms and a new engine block / cylinder head) and most parts are also covered by performance / upgrade options.
Trim, weatherstripping, finishing bits and pieces are well covered by reproduction (and still some OEM) parts.

Give me a call on 01277 374201 - if it is available, we'll get it for you...

 

[JonC]

Thanks Mike.
Need to get current project out the door, then go looking for a restoration candidate.

 

[SeanDezart]

The idea of the cleanest car you can get is structural, not panels and a time (and also) money-saver. Not to limit the budget but to spend where you WANT to (like the 3rd and 4th years getting your car right).

Join the club before getting a car as some stuff doesn't see the light and passes between members. Members are also more likely to help you, especially visit a car with you if you're a member.

Get a Z !

2 seater or 2+2 ?

 

[JonC]

"The idea of the cleanest car you can get is structural"
-- well yes, I wouldn't want an out of shape one, chassis is important, but never been bodged with rusty sills and floors and full of chicken shit may be better than fully bodged, doors don't shut, but nice paintwork.

"2 seater or 2+2"
Good question. I have a family so 2+2 would be more practical, but if I'm going to spend thousands restoring easier to resell might be better. Also, is 2+2 still a good car or is it a compromise too far?

 

[SeanDezart]

Problem is most UK cars "to be restored" have been bodged at some time or other to get through at least one more MOT before retiring to the garden or forgotten driveway..................

2+2 - as standard is not the same fun as a standard two seater but done right will bite the arse off a lot of 2 seaters out there - your choice !

Family ? Think hard how many times you'll have more than one person in your fun car in at least four years' time.

Resale - go for a 240Z any day but don't expect more than half back of what you put in.

Get a Z to drive.

 

[JonC]

Fair enough on the number of bodged UK cars. I'll cross that bridge when I come to it, the point is I'm expecting to have to replace a few panels. Getting a good chassis with panels in the right places (even if rusty) is the priority. If I have to use a US shell I suppose that's what I'll do.

2+2 -- Ok on engine mods, but how much heavier are they?

Resale: The point is that the same amount will be spent on restoration and then with a 2+2 you end up with a car that's worth less. It'll never be worth what you've put into it either way.

Family -- Hopefully we will still be together in 4 years time! It's not the most important consideration though. It may be the case that 2+2's are less molested in general, and there seem to be more of them for sale right now.

 

[SeanDezart]

Good points about the qty of unmolested 260s - they're not that much heavier (150kgs ?), go for a pair of f/g bumpers and a set of alloys and you're almost there !

If you want to have the opportunity to recover the maximum - go for a 240Z !

Family - you're missing the point - it's not whether you're still together - it's if the wife and the children WANT to go with with you and whether child seats are viable !!!

 

[JonC]

Mmmmmmm.... Child seats... Maybe I should buy a KIA bubble! They always want to go with me!
Actually as long as the car didn't have seatbelts from the factory it's perfectly legal to leave the kids rattling around in the back. Generations survived this treatment including myself and there's no substitute for driving carefully. Anyway... thats' off topic, tongue in cheek, and I won't be commenting on it again.

150Kg's seems like a lot to me. Like carrying an extra 2 passengers!

 

[SeanDezart]

Actually as long as the car didn't have seatbelts from the factory it's perfectly legal to leave the kids rattling around in the back.
150Kg's seems like a lot to me. Like carrying an extra 2 passengers!

You're the expert comparing weights..................and they're your kids. Meet up with someone who HAS a 2+2.

 

[JonC]

Yeah I think that's the answer, a real life comparison is required.
Didn't want to give you the impression that my 4 year old weighs 75KG.

 

[SeanDezart]

My two are 2 and 5 and I can garantee you that although I'd love to take all four around, it'd spoil MY fun in MY car ! And Mum although she likes the car, wouldn't be able to load it up with bags of spare clothes, boots just in case and two pushchairs.........

My 240Z was weighed at 1170 witha full tank - when my 2+2 currently being restored is finished, I'll weigh that too on the same weigh-bridge and let you know - give me 3 months though !

 

[JonC]

Sounds good.
Looked around on the ol' net and 240Z is listed as 1068KG with 260Z+2 at 1200KG.
If this is correct then it's 130KG, not far off what you said.

I'm looking forward to the day I can teach my daughters to weld, even being able to trust them to leave on the visor and fume mask would be a step in the right direction. Maybe that's the rule, when you've proved your welds have penetrated you can ride in the car, unfortunately that will rule out my wife indefinitely. Knowing her she'll disapprove a 2-seater in the way only women can, then when it's finished she'll want to use it to 'nip to the shops'!

 

[grolls]

Fair enough on the number of bodged UK cars. I'll cross that bridge when I come to it, the point is I'm expecting to have to replace a few panels. Getting a good chassis with panels in the right places (even if rusty) is the priority. If I have to use a US shell I suppose that's what I'll do.

2+2 -- Ok on engine mods, but how much heavier are they?

Resale: The point is that the same amount will be spent on restoration and then with a 2+2 you end up with a car that's worth less. It'll never be worth what you've put into it either way.

Family -- Hopefully we will still be together in 4 years time! It's not the most important consideration though. It may be the case that 2+2's are less molested in general, and there seem to be more of them for sale right now.

A fair few intersting points you have come to already in such a short period of time....not bad but;
Buying a 240/260 (2 seater) for your self induldgance is fine if you don't have to consider a family... i note my family love it in the 2+2 (including the wife) and have travelled up and down the country in it.

Purchasing a 2+2 is cheaper than a two seater and yet the cost of repair would be in essence the same as a 2 seater... so the level of performance and how much you are prepared to spend on it should be your first consideration. Just don't do it for financial gain because very few are able to make a proffit.....its all about driving an icon in my mind. What ever you chose to do have fun and lots of it. When mines back on the road your more than welcome to have a drive unless your french...:lol:

 

[JonC]

"Just don't do it for financial gain" --wouldn't dream of it, break the first law of auto restorers, as if!
"i note my family love it in the 2+2" -- Yeah, most of the time it is more fun if you can involve the family, most of the time.

 

[SeanDezart]

Just don't tart it up with beige leather like it was some footballers' wifes' car..............

He has a point though - restoring a 260Z 2+2 isn't more expensive than a 240 !