MZR Sport-Edition

[SeanDezart]

I wonder if we'll see a 110 Red and Rootes Bronze version with a big front spoiler?

No doubt we will for Rahail has at least 1x (can be seen on the samuri register).

......... but that sort of money is going to be reserved for examples as close to original as possible.

Is it ? I'm not convinced - most seem to aspire to something more sporty and with a different 'look' rather then stock.

The 240Z IS a Nissan.

....alright, alright but I feel that today, that badge does it less favours than the Datsun one of the era when everyone saw Cherrys and Sunnys !
At least 'Datsuns' were competing at works and privateer levels and also with teams like Janspeed, Samuri, BRE..race on Sunday.....!

 

[Alphabettispaghetti]

I wonder if we'll see a 110 Red and Rootes Bronze version with a big front spoiler?

Joking apart if they could get (buy) agreement from Spike it could be a money spinner.

It's been done with the Mini Cooper, Fiat 500 Abarth, Ford GT and come to think of it recently with the Samuri.

I think you’re wrongly biased

The only money spinner would be for spike.

 

[SeanDezart]

The only money spinner would be for spike.

Don't joke - I seriously think that is the name was revived, the cars would sell having been brought up to date.

 

[Alphabettispaghetti]

Don't joke - I seriously think that is the name was revived, the cars would sell having been brought up to date.

It’s history and tainted one at that. The name only has anyvalue to a very small audience.

That way people can learn to appreciate samuris, Mzr can build their own audience.

 

[uk66fastback]

Gimme stock every day of the week (now).

But if someone wants to give me an MZR I wouldn't complain ...

 

[Mr Ex Jnr]

No doubt we will for Rahail has at least 1x (can be seen on the samuri register).



Is it ? I'm not convinced - most seem to aspire to something more sporty and with a different 'look' rather then stock.

....alright, alright but I feel that today, that badge does it less favours than the Datsun one of the era when everyone saw Cherrys and Sunnys !
At least 'Datsuns' were competing at works and privateer levels and also with teams like Janspeed, Samuri, BRE..race on Sunday.....!

Raheil has got 2 samuri
lal 909k which has been 're straightened and jigged seen this in the workshop

And he owns WLY 448M but iv not seen this one

 

[uk66fastback]

WLY 448M is a red Morris 1300 not taxed for 30 years and LAL 909K is a silver 240z not taxed since 1976. It'll need a lot of straightening!

 

[Alphabettispaghetti]

The idea of the 'mzr sport-edition' is his own branding. I'd imagine he could create a track edition, luxury edition and a 'not Nissan-edition' just for sean

 

[JK240]

WLY 448M is a red Morris 1300 not taxed for 30 years and LAL 909K is a silver 240z not taxed since 1976. It'll need a lot of straightening!

Have a look here Mike, LAL came back from Greece I think a couple of years back, it was a steal at the time as it was mis-described I'm sure, can't remember the exact detail.

http://www.g8bgm.com/index_files/Page1566.htm

 

[Albrecht]

....and LAL 909K is a silver 240z not taxed since 1976. It'll need a lot of straightening!

Actually, the provenance of LAL 909K is pretty much impeccable. After Jonathan Bradburn's ownership it went into the hands of Arthur Carter in Norfolk for many years, pretending to be an ex-Works rally car (it wasn't, and isn't...) until that collection was broken up and it went into the Bonham's Goodwood sale that disposed of many of the 'Arthur Carter Collection' cars. It then pitched up in Greece, where the owner seems to have thought he had bought an ex-Works car. He hadn't. Now it is back in the UK.

It's an 'important' car in UK 240Z history, and one of - in my opinion at least - just three 'Samuri Conversions' cars that actually meant anything significant in period. I believe it will be restored - pragamatically - to its period specification.

 

[JK240]

Actually, the provenance of LAL 909K is pretty much impeccable. After Jonathan Bradburn's ownership it went into the hands of Arthur Carter in Norfolk for many years, pretending to be an ex-Works rally car (it wasn't, and isn't...) until that collection was broken up and it went into the Bonham's Goodwood sale

Was it because of the Bonhams catalogue mix up that it was thought to be an ex-Works car...?

 

[Rob Gaskin]

................... your buying an object that was owned by someone and that's the only reason it's expensive...............

.............I'm like John, I wouldn't pay more for one car over another just because someone famous once farted in it going through Eau Rouge.................

Guys, I've just watched a programme about Isambard Kingdom Brunel (what an engineer!) and they brought out his drawing instruments with which he would have designed amazing things. They showed signs of his dirty hands and they had his initials engraved on them.

Would you consider those to be more valuable, interesting and worthy of ownership than a new set you could buy tomorrow?

If not that's fine but I find it hard to understand. We are all different as John says.

 

[SeanDezart]

Guys, I've just watched a programme about Isambard Kingdom Brunel (what an engineer!) and they brought out his drawing instruments with which he would have designed amazing things. They showed signs of his dirty hands and they had his initials engraved on them.

Would you consider those to be more valuable, interseting and worthy of ownership than a new set you could buy tomorrow?

If not that's fine but I find it hard to understand. We are all different as John says.

You're out on a tangent Rob mate - wtf has IGB got to do with Bradford's Z specialist ?

 

[Rob Gaskin]

You're out on a tangent Rob mate - wtf has IGB got to do with Bradford's Z specialist ?

Yes I am but I'm trying to find out what makes member's tick. Perhaps another thread maybe.

What makes an old car worth owning?

 

[SeanDezart]

Yes I am but I'm trying to find out what makes member's tick. Perhaps another thread maybe.

What makes an old car worth owning?

Too simple a question.

A 240Z is nearly 50 years old.

Perceived 'value' is down to the car's notoriety whilst in production, competition wins, famous owners....anthing that stands out from the crowd - the US love the 'series 1s' for example, the UK loves its' RHDs......despite being rarer than all, the 260Z hasn't made it ! I think the trick is to pick out the unloved cars and love their difference !

 

[Albrecht]

Was it because of the Bonhams catalogue mix up that it was thought to be an ex-Works car...?

The photos got mixed up in the Bonhams catalogues which probably didn't help, but neither car was an ex-Works 240Z rally car anyway. They just had a conglomeration of various ex-Works parts attached to them...

The problem goes back to Arthur Carter really. He had tried to sell both (actually three...) cars privately over the years without success, and the fact that one of them was actually 'LAL' had kind of been overlooked. Or at least obscured by the "ex-Works rally car" stories, which were - when it comes down to it - pure fantasy. The irony is that 'LAL', a car with a genuine and quite interesting (if not successful) competition history, was hiding in plain sight.

They have a saying in Japan which is quite apt. It translates along the lines of "the darkest place is at the foot of the lighthouse..."

 

[johnymd]

To try and simplify an answer for you Rob. I buy things to use. I don’t buy paintings because of who painted them or objects to look at and say x made that. I’m not saying there is anything wrong with it but it’s just not me. If I buy a car it’s because I want to drive and enjoy it. Not to leave in a heated garage hope it goes up in value. If I can’t use and enjoy something then it has no value to me. Maybe if I had the money to buy appreciating objects then I would look at things differently.

In your example above, I would buy the new item as I could use it and it would probably work better.

 

[Rob Gaskin]

Ok guys 'I'm Out' as Alan said because we have gone way off topic here but I started that to try to explain that in my mind old cars need to be old and if possible have 'provenance'. Unlike you John I don't use my Datsuns very much - which is what perhaps influences my feelings.

I need to see an MZR car and it will also be interesting when they come on the secondhand market.

 

[SeanDezart]

I buy things to use. I don’t buy paintings because of who painted them or objects to look at and say x made that. If I buy a car it’s because I want to drive and enjoy it. Not to leave in a heated garage hope it goes up in value.

In your example above, I would buy the new item as I could use it and it would probably work better.

My philosophy too and why I wouldn't buy the no.5 (even if I had the money) 'cos I don't like rallying.
I'd buy a works circuit car (again, if I had the money) but not to bragg.
Ultimately it'll be less expensive and more efficient today to build one from scratch or modify one for sale on BAT. But not to speculate on its value, merely for the fun of use.

I wouldn't buy an MZR - too bespoke (I was always attracted to the Zs black cabin for its purity, simplicity, almost '60s than '70s style with the diamond body trim and I'm not a fan of large diameter wheels with low-profile tyres.
One of those cars that're nice to look at....but better in someone elses' garage.

 

[SeanDezart]

but I started that to try to explain that in my mind old cars need to be old and if possible have 'provenance'.

Rob - how did you feel when Nissan USA commissioned a run of new 240Zs ?

What if it happened here in Europe to celebrate the 50yrs ?