F1 - great race. | Page 2 | The Z Club of Great Britain
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F1 - great race.

Discussion in 'Rally & race' started by Rob Gaskin, Jun 6, 2021.

  1. Bazzateer

    Bazzateer
    Z Club Member

    Blimey! Some sensitive souls on here :chillpill:.

    As I said, I thought it was a cracker (it included 18 other drivers apart from Lewis and Max you know:conf2:). Le Clerc was amazing, Lando and Danny Ric also were great IMHO.

    I also said I thought Lewis was mostly to blame for Max going off. I doubt very much he deliberately punted Max off. He was too ambitious, and possibly a bit reckless, but I don't believe he intended that to happen which appears to be implied by the use of terms like "punted off".

    As to apologising, F1 drivers often fail to accept blame for collisions etc so Lewis is doing nothing that unusual.

    Then the celebrations. He'd just won his home Grand Prix after a difficult start to the race (his own fault of course). Max was fine, if a little knocked about, so I don't see why Lewis should not celebrate.

    They are the best two drivers out there at the moment, today's version of Senna/Prost. I can't wait for Hungary.
     
  2. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    I'm not so sensitive - I merely don't agree with all you've said so take a chew on that pill :chillpill:too buddy.:)

    I for one believe that he didn't punt him off on purpose but that was the inevitable result of his action and he knew it.

    Max saw him coming down and moved outside, knowing he had the faster line and would exit the curve in front of Hamilton. He just didn't expect Lewis to risk an accident by continuing on his (Lewis' line).

    The stewards are not saying "it was mostly his or his fault" - they squarely blamed Lewis although the feeble nature of the penalty awarded didn't match the severity of Lewis' reckless actions.

    Lewis should celebrate, sure, but what he did was tactless to say the least....
     
  3. Albrecht

    Albrecht Well-Known Forum User

    I'm old enough to remember what you mean, but you might want to look up 'cracker' in the latest urban dictionary to see what I'm getting at (hint hint). Don't want to see you getting taken out of context.

    :facepalm:

    We Race As One though...
     
  4. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    The local crowd certainly cheered as the championship leader was pushed off and hit the tyre-wall at an horrific velocity.

    Mind you, that does seem to be par for the course these days in support of any local boy......Steve said it right 'a professional blood-sport'....it'll be Rollerball next race so I hope Max sits it out and acts coolly !
     
  5. jonbills

    jonbills
    ZClub Administrator
    Moderator

    Whats Robbie Coltrane got to do with F1?
     
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  6. franky

    franky Well-Known Forum User

    Oh dear, its a good job this isn't social media!
     
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  7. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    It's a shame that certain words have become hjijacked by the media and cannot now be comfortably used in social exchanges. Perhaps I should have more politically correct have said 'A black-flag day for racing'....

    Hasn't saved him though which is disgraceful....but a more and more common spill-over from Brexit and the popular nationalism.....imho.

    https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/...abuse-of-hamilton.1Ml2uo6t9cGtHOglVYxNce.html
     
  8. Rob Gaskin

    Rob Gaskin Treasurer Staff Member Moderator

    Guys I need to watch the incident again (I'm away from home) and hear drivers and commentators comments but I saw it as a racing incident. Sean you have said that F1 is boring well now you see the consequences of close racing. It was inevitable that these two were going to have a head to head last one to blink moment. As I said on another Thread drivers are prepared to risk accidents in this era and both did.

    Also yes if Hamilton was at fault it was a minor penalty but if it was considered 50/50 then perhaps he was given a penalty to look as if there was no favoritism.

    I have an open mind atm and I like both drivers so I'm not biased. This is a battle we have seen in other eras and it's what makes F1 memories.
     
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  9. uk66fastback

    uk66fastback
    Z Club Member

    Same thing, surely?

    He was unlucky to even get the penalty in my view and I’m a fan of both of them, not a Hamilton fanboy.

    Hamilton had the line and was up the inside, if anything, Max cut across him to me.

    Verstappen certainly wasn’t going to back off, as he hadn’t in a previous corner, outbraking Hamilton. In this instance, IMO, he should have … he didn’t have the line.

    I do think Hamilton could have shown concern for him though in the post-match interview, it was like it had never happened …

    As for Christian Horner moaning on, blimey …
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2021
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  10. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    Hi Rob - yes, I believe you need to watch it again ; it appears that Lewis wanted to carry his superior speed into the bend, knew not to do that on the outside of a circuit he knows well but didn't have the racing line.

    Max saw him and visibly moves slightly to the outside to avoid him.....Lewis keeps coming - not sure I follow your 50/50 when the race stewards already blamed Lewis 100%.

    Racing HAS been boring but the close battle between these two has livened it up although as in football, one player doesn't make a team, 2x out of a grid don't make a race - plenty of action further back.

    I don't like to have memories of F1 because of racing incidents but from the struggle between drivers for supremacy. This race should have been one of the best in history, instead it became predictable as there is no-one but Max capable of meeting Lewis in talent, determination and in a competitive car.

    I'm not biased either and I lost respect for Schumacher for his 'little tricks', Prost for having 'bought' his last F1 championship.....Lewis was under pressure and went too far. I feel that the FIA should relook for an appropriate penalty, something like a 10x place grid penalty for the next race. He was penalised the same as (I forget who) who crossed the pitlane sold-white line......hardly in the same league.
     
  11. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    No, not the same thing - placing yourself in a position where someone can 'choose' to hit you when taking the racing line or deliberately aiming at someone is different.

    Max was slightly off the line because he's moved out to avoid Lewis. Max took the racing line on a 160mph bend, even the race stewards agreed that Lewis was nowhere near the apex and therefore NOT on the line.

     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2021
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  12. moggy240

    moggy240 INSURANCE VALUATIONS OFFICER Staff Member Moderator

    I actually enjoyed watching the race which makes a change.
     
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  13. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    Why ? What was different - the sprint before ?
     
  14. uk66fastback

    uk66fastback
    Z Club Member

    What should be the discussion is that a guy can get penalised 10secs yet still win the race pretty easily … so much for F1 being competitive to any great extent again … okay, it was Silverstone, a track made for Lewis and his car.

    If you let two great drivers race, there are going to be incidents and cars leaving the track … it stands to reason. Hamilton was all over Max and to be honest, chose to turn in, knowing Lewis was there … let’s just be thankful the crash wasn’t a lot worse.
     
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  15. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    Can't complain about Silverstone being 'his' track when RedBull have just had two races at theirs !

    The penalty didn't fit the incident - how can causing a huge accident on such a fast bend warrant the same as 'oops, I accidently crossed the white pitlane entrance line ie disciplined but not dangerous.

    Hamilton WAS all over Max, who saw him and moved over to avoid him. Hamilton then figured that he'd 'won' the bend despite being way off the line - he'd never have made the move without sliding outwards...towards Verstappen and they both knew it. Verstappen shouldn't be criticised for wanting to turn on a bend into which he WAS first : they weren't side by side, Hamilton wasn't in front and the race stewards have already agreed that it was 100% Hamiltons' fault - I don't see how this can still be contested here !

    Hamilton bullied his way through - some would call it gutsy, some reckless....but he deserved a stop and go at least and not a mere 10 second pause ! Both drivers in their cars can overcome 10seconds.
     
  16. uk66fastback

    uk66fastback
    Z Club Member

    So he moved over to avoid him and then turned in on him ... makes no sense! He should have taken the moral high ground and backed off (and still remained in the race) - he chose not to. That's how I saw it.
     
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  17. AliK

    AliK
    Z Club Member
    Staff Member Moderator

    Motorsport can be dangerous - who would have thought it!

    I don't care about the stewards, any politics or other you tube / media opinions - what I have repeatedly watched with my own eyes suggests two great, aggressive and massively competitive drivers fighting for a corner where neither of them backed down. This is racing! It's been the preserve of F1 and will continue to be so. Max knowing full well Lewis was there (regardless of his right to the line) could have gone a tiny bit wider and avoided it. Lewis knowing full well Max would try to keep his line could have braked or gone tighter. But the fact is, neither gave each other quarter. Haven't we seen this before time and again? It's just part of racing.

    If that tyre had stayed on and he didn't hit the wall as a result, might we be saying the penalty was appropriate and that it was a racing incident?

    But yes, it was very poor sportsmanship to have not mentioned a word of concern for Max during the celebrations (I did lose a fair bit of respect for him - he should have been a better man).
     
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  18. SeanDezart

    SeanDezart Well-Known Forum User

    I would have loved to have seen Hamilton make it through 'one close corner each'.....and then the race would have been on....as it was, the race was like a old glass of still champagne - tasty, cool but missing the fizz !
     
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  19. Robbie J

    Robbie J
    Z Club Member

    The race director is Michael Masi BTW and he is from Oz (they call us Pomme's BTW Sean as you know). If you look at the video Hamilton is turning into the apex but when they hit it straightens the wheel. It's likely he was getting understeer but aware that as Max was on the outside he would do better if there was contact. Max didn't see him until it was too late

    Not saying I'm biased in any way because I'm mostly English and we have our logo on the side of the car...

    Hey, we are discussing it and looking forward to the next one, far better than last year......
     
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  20. arcdef

    arcdef
    Z Club Member

    Everyone is making such a big deal out of this, it is not like he set out going into that corner to hit max Like Senna did with Prost or Schumacher did to Hill.

    He pulled off the same move 2 more times during the race so anyone saying its impossible or shouldn't be done are clearly wrong.

    It takes 2 to tango, Max is notoriously aggressive in his racing, he cant expect everyone to get out of his way all the time and if neither back down they will crash.

    Its even tempting to put money down that they will crash again this season - both will be very fired up and I have the popcorn ready!
     

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