toopy
Club Member
As for sounding posh, that’s just my phone voice. Besides, I was trying to tone it down
LOL, posh! please..... you drive a Datsun! more well spoken!
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123 ignition for Datsun L6 on my L28
- Thread starter AliK
- Start date
LOL, posh! please..... you drive a Datsun! more well spoken!
Thank you sir! That’s good to know and I will look into it! [emoji106]
atomman
Club Member
Here's the part numbers
Distributor cap: Bosch 1.235.522.060
Beru VK 102
Thought so Porashe 911 2.7 etc
ebay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bosch-12...187439?hash=item3652ba7d2f:g:x3wAAOSwQ8ZdWSgy
https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_...Distributor+cap:+Bosch+1.235.522.060&_sacat=0
Just be careful that the cap has holes not pin's , as people sometimes don't understand part numbers on ebay
Distributor cap: Bosch 1.235.522.060
Beru VK 102
Thought so Porashe 911 2.7 etc
ebay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bosch-12...187439?hash=item3652ba7d2f:g:x3wAAOSwQ8ZdWSgy
https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_...Distributor+cap:+Bosch+1.235.522.060&_sacat=0
Just be careful that the cap has holes not pin's , as people sometimes don't understand part numbers on ebay
Thanks dude! Much appreciated ! [emoji106][emoji106]
Pondo
Club Member
So I’ve been thinking about a new dizzy for a while and was looking at the 123 ignition, would you Gary and you Ali still go for the same setup now or would you opt for something different such as the Speeduino? I’ve read differing reviews on them I can say I’m probably more confused now than I was before I started.
uk66fastback
Club Member
What he said ... ^^^^
Sorry to be the cause of confusion!! But glad to be of service all the same
Really tough question to answer, because ...
On the upside:
I really like the flexibility of the custom timing curve. Adjusting timing without the timing light or popping the engine bay makes experimenting so much quicker.
The built in rev limiter and immobiliser are great to have, especially as I still have the reversion issues at 2.2 and 3k KRPM; adding a couple of extra degrees at those points makes them more like flat spots than torque holes.
Unlike the speeduino, it is relatively plug and play and you don’t need to solder anything.
With the 280zx dizzy I was worried about “timing scatter” at high RPMs and potential pinking given the vac advance was adding 15 degrees on top of the 32 dialled in. With a “rate of attack” that was Unknown, it was a concern. Bear in mind most 280zx dizzies will have worn shafts / bushes.
On the downside:
I’m really unimpressed with the issues I’ve been having or some of the quality issues I’ve listed earlier in the thread. I spent the money to not have issues or worries and in fact it’s been quite the opposite.
The speeduino, from what I’ve seen on JB’s thread provides vastly better data logging and better control over the timing / Full ignition map capabilities.
The 280zx dizzy with the 12-80 match box was hassle free, except that it wasn’t as solid on timing at the higher RPMs as the 123. Also the vac advance adjustment being analogue was a bit of a faff and a case of trial and error. Does this matter for on road driving? Nope!
Would I have bought knowing what I know now? And at that price point? The jury is still out for another year. But suffice it to say I had the same butt dyno performance with the 280zx dizzy.
I would say stick to the 280zx dizzy unless you have the need to do custom timing curves etc. When I’ve put the two of them back to back and gone for a drive, the 123 is noticeably and subtly smoother in operation than the 280zx dizzy. The engine responds to throttle transitions more smoothly. But the power difference (if there is one at all) is not noticeable. The cost is less than half.
Many old lags on the racing scene say stick to the 280zx dizzy. But I guess your question was about speeduino.
If that came as a ready to plug in solution without the need for a trigger wheel, then I would jump at it.
Does that help at all!?
Really tough question to answer, because ...
On the upside:
I really like the flexibility of the custom timing curve. Adjusting timing without the timing light or popping the engine bay makes experimenting so much quicker.
The built in rev limiter and immobiliser are great to have, especially as I still have the reversion issues at 2.2 and 3k KRPM; adding a couple of extra degrees at those points makes them more like flat spots than torque holes.
Unlike the speeduino, it is relatively plug and play and you don’t need to solder anything.
With the 280zx dizzy I was worried about “timing scatter” at high RPMs and potential pinking given the vac advance was adding 15 degrees on top of the 32 dialled in. With a “rate of attack” that was Unknown, it was a concern. Bear in mind most 280zx dizzies will have worn shafts / bushes.
On the downside:
I’m really unimpressed with the issues I’ve been having or some of the quality issues I’ve listed earlier in the thread. I spent the money to not have issues or worries and in fact it’s been quite the opposite.
The speeduino, from what I’ve seen on JB’s thread provides vastly better data logging and better control over the timing / Full ignition map capabilities.
The 280zx dizzy with the 12-80 match box was hassle free, except that it wasn’t as solid on timing at the higher RPMs as the 123. Also the vac advance adjustment being analogue was a bit of a faff and a case of trial and error. Does this matter for on road driving? Nope!
Would I have bought knowing what I know now? And at that price point? The jury is still out for another year. But suffice it to say I had the same butt dyno performance with the 280zx dizzy.
I would say stick to the 280zx dizzy unless you have the need to do custom timing curves etc. When I’ve put the two of them back to back and gone for a drive, the 123 is noticeably and subtly smoother in operation than the 280zx dizzy. The engine responds to throttle transitions more smoothly. But the power difference (if there is one at all) is not noticeable. The cost is less than half.
Many old lags on the racing scene say stick to the 280zx dizzy. But I guess your question was about speeduino.
If that came as a ready to plug in solution without the need for a trigger wheel, then I would jump at it.
Does that help at all!?
Vacuum advance:
Pinking happens 'under load' but in that situation the VA doesn't add any advance does it?
Surprised you still had the VA connected I don't on either of my cars.
Did your's work - did you try sucking on the pipe to the dizzy. You can do that with the cap off and see if the base-plate moves smoothly.
How does the 123 system cater for 'load' if it has no sensors?
Pinking happens 'under load' but in that situation the VA doesn't add any advance does it?
Surprised you still had the VA connected I don't on either of my cars.
Did your's work - did you try sucking on the pipe to the dizzy. You can do that with the cap off and see if the base-plate moves smoothly.
How does the 123 system cater for 'load' if it has no sensors?
Alphabettispaghetti
Club Member
Kameari do one. Go Direct for support also.
https://www.rhdjapan.com/kameari-l-...gnition-control-kit-with-spindle-gear-l6.html
240L31
Club Member
I'm running a remanufactured 280zx dizzy on my 3.1 stroker. The vacuum advance helps a lot during throttle transitions, revs climb much more quickly with the VA connected.
My point: if it is working correctly, there is absolutely no reason (I can think of) to disconnect it.
Correct, it does, however a rate of attack - I.e. how quickly the distributor responds to load and takes away the vac advance - if slow, will cause pinking on the transition. While most disconnect it, I feel it’s an important part of the function of a distributor for keeping idle temps down and getting good / full burn outside of WOT conditions. I find the car to be much smoother with it on and idle temps drop by a quarter on the gauge when in traffic.
However on a modified engine running high compression, you have to adjust it down to avoid part throttle pinking - lots of research papers out there by engineers showing it’s a good thing for anything that’s not constantly WOT (like a race car). I didn’t save the links sadly, so I can’t share them but I will if I come across them again. Good geeky petrolhead reading.
With lots of experimentation, i went from the 25 degrees (Max) the 280zx one was adding, down to about 10 degrees. Also with the 123 you can decide how much and at what pressure to suit your engine / preferences.
Yes it did and yes I did, all was well with it.
It has a Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) sensor that connects to the same part of the manifold as the normal vac advance tube.
Franky - how are your Kameari shares doing!? [emoji12]
atomman
Club Member
I do like my 123 , Luckly I haven't had the problems that Ali has had ,
I was advised by my dyno bloke to send the old 280zx dizzy away and get it re-curved , for the triples, I would also get them to check it over for wear and rebuild it if necessary , which being an 80's unit would be a good idea , when you take this cost in to account say £150 ish to do all that , you could spend the extra and get all the adjustablity of the 123 ,
When I sort out the other higher compression head with bigger valve's , I will probably need to adjust the curve all data over again , so it was a bit of forward thinking ,
I don't know how many people send their 280zx dizzy away and get it re-curved properly though , I bet most just run them as is , I know i did until i went to the dyno.
I was advised by my dyno bloke to send the old 280zx dizzy away and get it re-curved , for the triples, I would also get them to check it over for wear and rebuild it if necessary , which being an 80's unit would be a good idea , when you take this cost in to account say £150 ish to do all that , you could spend the extra and get all the adjustablity of the 123 ,
When I sort out the other higher compression head with bigger valve's , I will probably need to adjust the curve all data over again , so it was a bit of forward thinking ,
I don't know how many people send their 280zx dizzy away and get it re-curved properly though , I bet most just run them as is , I know i did until i went to the dyno.
Well now this is interesting ....
https://123ignitionusa.com/oem-rotor-modified-no-resistor-for-all-4-and-6-cyl-123-applications/
https://123ignitionusa.com/oem-rotor-modified-no-resistor-for-all-4-and-6-cyl-123-applications/
Thanks for the heads up on the other cars - here’s a list of other part numbers in case useful to anyone else ...
BERU: VK102, VK155,
BMW: 12111351446, 12111353117,
BREMI: 8017P,
DAF: 163793,
EPS: 1.306.072,
FACET: 2.7472PHT,
FORD: 11710256,
KW: 806072,
MERCEDES-BENZ: 0001580702, 0001582502, 0001585302, 10001585302, A0001580702, A0001582502, A0001585302,
MWM: 606908730203,
OPEL: 1212135, 1212138,
PORSCHE: 90160295600, 91160293300, QUINTON HAZELL: XD138,
SMPE: 44160,
STELLOX: 21-00002-SX, 21-00746-SX, 21-00779-SX
Bosch one currently selling at £23 on eBay or £21 on AUTODOC. Beru at £7-£9. I bought a spare cap from 123 when I bought the dizzy - it was a Beru and around £46; oh and it arrived broken, the centre electrode was broken off before coming out of packaging! See the pic below, the cap on the left ....
BERU: VK102, VK155,
BMW: 12111351446, 12111353117,
BREMI: 8017P,
DAF: 163793,
EPS: 1.306.072,
FACET: 2.7472PHT,
FORD: 11710256,
KW: 806072,
MERCEDES-BENZ: 0001580702, 0001582502, 0001585302, 10001585302, A0001580702, A0001582502, A0001585302,
MWM: 606908730203,
OPEL: 1212135, 1212138,
PORSCHE: 90160295600, 91160293300, QUINTON HAZELL: XD138,
SMPE: 44160,
STELLOX: 21-00002-SX, 21-00746-SX, 21-00779-SX
Bosch one currently selling at £23 on eBay or £21 on AUTODOC. Beru at £7-£9. I bought a spare cap from 123 when I bought the dizzy - it was a Beru and around £46; oh and it arrived broken, the centre electrode was broken off before coming out of packaging! See the pic below, the cap on the left ....
So a brief update, my new cap arrived this afternoon so did a monsoon from the Amazon. So unable to pull the car out of the garage I set about getting rid of the resistor in the rotor. I used a 2mm drill on the sides first then watch screw drivers to gouge ourt with.
Strangely, very strangely, I found zero metal between the tip contact and the centre contact. Nor a resistor as others on the TR forums have found.
Just lots and lots of what felt and looked like glass fibre; which was itchy as the loft insulation all over my hands. If you do this job, wear gloves!!
Then I used a bit of Earth cable from some twin and earth off cuts to push in a connection between the two. I like things in car electrics being “mechanically” connected first.
Then soldered both ends and went a little obsessive, soldering the entire thing for reduced vibrations.
Finally added some JB weld to keep things from vibrating, provide more mechanical stability and get a decent finish on her ...
OK it took an hour or so in front of Netflix but quite pleased with the outcome + now it measures 0.2ohms. Will have to try it and report back.
Strangely, very strangely, I found zero metal between the tip contact and the centre contact. Nor a resistor as others on the TR forums have found.
Just lots and lots of what felt and looked like glass fibre; which was itchy as the loft insulation all over my hands. If you do this job, wear gloves!!
Then I used a bit of Earth cable from some twin and earth off cuts to push in a connection between the two. I like things in car electrics being “mechanically” connected first.
Then soldered both ends and went a little obsessive, soldering the entire thing for reduced vibrations.
Finally added some JB weld to keep things from vibrating, provide more mechanical stability and get a decent finish on her ...
OK it took an hour or so in front of Netflix but quite pleased with the outcome + now it measures 0.2ohms. Will have to try it and report back.
Last edited:
uk66fastback
Club Member
Blimey, belt and braces or what! Good stuff ...
