Thinking of buying a Z .. Can I ask a few questions?!

Tony Mc

Club Member
I've always loved these cars since I was a kid in the 80s, but I ended up going down a BMW route and currently own a lovely low mileage e46 M3 which a brilliant all-rounder. But recently I've found myself lusting after 240/260/280Zs! I also have a supercharged R53 Mini as the main runabout, so the M3 is mostly used for weekends and long drives. I realise a Z wouldn't be anything like as practical or comfortable for long journeys, but maybe I'd get another cheap car for those and sell the Mini.

I've just read @Rob Gaskin 's great buyers guide, and I'm trying to read as much as possible about these cars before I start asking the same old questions, but I've reached a point where I still need to ask some of them! :)

I'm starting to get a steer on the values, and what certain features add or take away to the prices. Seems you can still get the occasional bargain at auctions, but the restored RHD Zs are pricey on the whole!

With my M3, the body was immaculate, and all I've done is cosmetic work - new paint on the front end, replaced various worn internal & external trims, seats, wheels, etc. Everything is available, and 99% of it new - but I gather from Rob's guide, this is not quite the same case with the Zs?

Apart from the dashboards (which I know are like hen's teeth), are you able to buy new parts from Datsun for any of the interior, or external trim parts? In the guide, it says Nissan & pattern part suppliers supply a lot of mechanical parts, which sounds promising. But then it sounds like alternators and starter motors are not available, so have to be refurbished used parts? How much are we talking for things like that? What about a clutch? Are any other common points of failure not available new?

And what about aftermarket suspension? I see a lot of youtube videos featuring cars with coilovers. Surely no, or very few manufacturers sell new coilovers for such an old car? Do they have to engineer parts intended for another car onto a Z? Same question for shocks and springs I guess.

Finally, as I have never been in a Z, let alone driven one, I think I really need to sort that out before I go much further! Does anyone have any advice about how I can go about that? I would never want to give a seller false hope by turning up to test drive their car without the intention of buying it.

So are there any non-selling (or at least, not yet selling) owners in the North West who fancy showing off their car to a prospective new owner?!

The oldest thing I've driven was my '85 Baur E30 convertible, which was agricultural to say the least, but that was partly due to the poor condition it was in. Other than that, my dad had a Mark II Jag, and a '72 Lotus Elan +2, which is probably the most comparable to a Z I guess. But I never drove either, so I just don't know what to expect.

Thanks for any advice!
Hi George,
You are welcome to come and have a nosey at my Z in a week or two. I am in sunny Salford.
It is more or less stock and an example of what can come up on auction sites every now and again.
Cheers
Tony Mc
 

Robotsan

Club Member
RE: the suspension question - there are dedicated adjustable coilover solutions for these cars but most require welding of some sort, as the strut/hub assembly needs to be retained. The cheap option are generic style weld-on threaded sleeves, adjustable platforms, aftermarket shocks like Tokico Illumina, KYB, or Koni, etc., and use 2.5" springs in rates matched to what you want it to perform like. Beyond that, there are every more elaborate and expensive options, adding adjustment and ££££ everywhere.

Probably the most cost-effective and decent setup off-the-shelf is that by BC Racing. That requires the strut tubes to be cut down to 40-50mm and a threaded tube welded on over the top. The whole coilover assembly then screws in, allowing height adjustment separate from spring preload. They also come with camber plates that do not require the strut housing tops to be cut or welded.
https://www.bc-racing.co.uk/applica...z-280z/nissan-240z-260z-51mm-strut-70-73.html
(image on site is generic, not of a Z set)
Another site to get familiar with:
https://technotoytuning.com/nissan/240z
Various companies in Japan make coilover kits obviously.

Of course, there are also simple off-the-shelf lowering springs from various makers and shock inserts are available that fit the standard length tubes, some with added adjustability.

https://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/CTGY/classic20c01
https://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/CTGY/classic20b01
https://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/CTGY/classic20b04

Thanks, that's really helpful. To be honest, I prefer good quality shocks and springs rather than coilovers anyway. Too much maintenance, too easy to seize up, and none I've had have given as nice a ride - so I've come to the conclusion that unless you're spending £2k+, they're best for track cars.

I've put a nice set of Konis with H&R springs on my M3 and it transformed it. It came with HSD coilovers, but the ride was just awful, despite not riding that low at all.
 

Robotsan

Club Member
Gone with ebach lowering springs, Koni adjustable dampers and new top hat insulators to allow more travel. Wasn't keen on cutting / welding coilovers in myself. Will update my build thread once that's done though - just as an alternative to coil overs.

Robotsan, you're asking the right questions though and as you can see, the club have a lot of experience to give you should you take the plunge.

SacCyclone is right; rust is the biggest problem with these cars and getting one from a dry place in the states or even one from the UK that's been restored is key for a good base to start from.

Where you go from there is up to you, you can restore as far as you can to original spec, use the car as a platform and put a more modern engine and drivetrain in with some clever restomods that you see on here. Or break into the racing scene as so many others have before.

Good luck m8, hope to see you here in the future :D

Thanks man, that's good to hear. As I've just mentioned above, I prefer dampers & springs anyway, so that sounds promising.

Yeah it does seem that there's a huge range of directions people go with these cars. I'm more of an OEM+ kind of person. So I would probably keep the bodywork OEM, but fit wider wheels and tyres. Not the arch flares route *I don't think*. I think these cars look as good as the Aston Martins and Jags of the 70s, especially with tasteful wheels and in the dark blues or greens, or in silver.

I realise these cars wouldn't feel what you could call quick, but I imagine they're roughly similar to my R53 Mini - that weighs about 1300kg and has about 170bhp. Plenty in something small and nimble where your arse is close to the ground. But out of interest, what are the options, and how much would you have to spend to get the 2.4, 2.6, or 2.8 pushing 180 - 200 bhp, but still N/A? I've seen some for sale which have been bored out it seems.
 

Robotsan

Club Member
Hi George,
You are welcome to come and have a nosey at my Z in a week or two. I am in sunny Salford.
It is more or less stock and an example of what can come up on auction sites every now and again.
Cheers
Tony Mc

Hi Tony! No way, these offers are getting nearer and nearer! :) I'm in Whalley Range at the moment, but moving to Firswood soonish (where I'll have a driveway and a single garage, finally!). I've never seen a Z in Manchester or Salford, how long have you had it?

I'd love to pop round and have a look sometime, thank you. I'll drop you a message sometime.

Cheers!
 

MCBladeRun

Club Member
Thanks man, that's good to hear. As I've just mentioned above, I prefer dampers & springs anyway, so that sounds promising.

Yeah it does seem that there's a huge range of directions people go with these cars. I'm more of an OEM+ kind of person. So I would probably keep the bodywork OEM, but fit wider wheels and tyres. Not the arch flares route *I don't think*. I think these cars look as good as the Aston Martins and Jags of the 70s, especially with tasteful wheels and in the dark blues or greens, or in silver.

I realise these cars wouldn't feel what you could call quick, but I imagine they're roughly similar to my R53 Mini - that weighs about 1300kg and has about 170bhp. Plenty in something small and nimble where your arse is close to the ground. But out of interest, what are the options, and how much would you have to spend to get the 2.4, 2.6, or 2.8 pushing 180 - 200 bhp, but still N/A? I've seen some for sale which have been bored out it seems.
Others have a better idea than I do as, I'm not quite there with the engine. My limited knowledge on the subject of gaining more BHP with a NA engine would be to allow it to breathe better so, getting a more flowing exhaust manifold and letting the carbs have less restrictive airflow would be the start. The next things are the combustion chambers, some members have had their 2.8 litre engines bored out more and increased the stroke (I think) to push the engine to about 3.1 litres (and even 3.2). There is a lot of choice on carbs, but I believe balance is the key. If you're pushing 3.1 litres then, a standard carburettor might not be sufficient to bring its fuel requirements. I myself have the old 'round top' Hitachi SU on my 2.8 which is fine.

There's porting the head and lots of benefits from engine modifications to get more BHP, but others can comment on this process.

Other than that, you can lower the compression, stick throttle bodies and an aftermarket ECU in place to go the turbo route. But then the engine would need further mods to combat the pitfalls of this direction.

These engines are pretty much bomb proof though, you'd be hard pressed to damage one.

I was going to flair my arches, or roll them in order to fit bigger wheels etc. But after looking at how original my arches are, I decided not to. But who knows, might strip it down and find it's a cut and shut! It's been known to happen to the best of us.
 

Tony Mc

Club Member
Hi Tony! No way, these offers are getting nearer and nearer! :) I'm in Whalley Range at the moment, but moving to Firswood soonish (where I'll have a driveway and a single garage, finally!). I've never seen a Z in Manchester or Salford, how long have you had it?

I'd love to pop round and have a look sometime, thank you. I'll drop you a message sometime.

Cheers!
You would have had to be walking past my house to have seen my car! Had it nearly 2 years now and done about 10 miles. It is now a matter of days away from being safe to get out and enjoy.
 

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Rob Gaskin

Treasurer
Staff member
Site Administrator
George these cars can be quick. My trackday car was 200bhp and 1100kg with full rollcage. I remember well a Trax day at Silverstone. We had a warm up lap behind a pace car and a guy (wearing race suit and shoes) in a silver e46 M3 csl was giving it lock to lock to warm his tyres. He was a couple of cars in front of me - when the pace car pulled in I focused on him and finished a few yards behind. Bear in mind this is Silverstone Club cct with long straights. My nephew who is a big BMW fan (Alpina owner) was amazed at my old Datsun giving a CSL a run for its money.

Anyway we need to see a picture of your M3 - I might take it in PX.;)
 
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Robotsan

Club Member
You would have had to be walking past my house to have seen my car! Had it nearly 2 years now and done about 10 miles. It is now a matter of days away from being safe to get out and enjoy.

Haha oh ok. As in the car is safe enough to get out in and enjoy, or something else?!
 

Robotsan

Club Member
George these cars can be quick. My trackday car was 200bhp and 1100kg with full rollcage. I remember well a Trax day at Silverstone. We had a warm up lap behind a pace car and a guy (wearing race suit and shoes) in a silver e46 M3 csl was giving it lock to lock to warm his tyres. He was a couple of cars in front of me - when the pace car pulled in I focused on him and finished a few yards behind. Bear in mind this is Silverstone Club cct with long straights. My nephew who is a big BMW fan (Alpina owner) was amazed at my old Datsun giving a CSL a run for its money.

Anyway we need to see a picture of your M3 - I might take it in PX.;)

That's a mint little story! A CSL is ridiculously fast around a track like that, and not heavy either! Think they're about 1300kg from memory. And with another 150 bhp over your Z, so I wonder if you were just a faster driver?!

Here's a few choice snaps of the M3. I imagine you'd be wanting a packet of crisps plus my M3 in exchange for your Z!
 

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dcrobbo

Club Member
Thanks so much Mike, lots of really helpful information there!

Regarding suspension then, are there modern shocks, springs (or coilovers) that are just plug and play on these cars then? No additional welding or engineering necessary?

Good to know engine parts aren't too pricey. They certainly can be on the M3 but not prohibitively so. There's some expensive maintenance 'events' on these though - rod bearings have to be done by 100k (£1500 job), and the boot floors crack (£1500 - £3000 job), plus Vanos (£1000 - 1.5k), but general maintenance is OK.

How much are we talking for a LHD to RHD conversion in UK, does anyone know? I also hear its pricier on a 240z as the RHD dashboards are rarer?

I do feel like a 260 or 280 might be a better bet for me, to hopefully get something in better condition for the same money. I realise that's all relative though, and bargains can be had in the 240z world if you're lucky.

How does the fuel injected 2.8 in the 280z compare to the carbed 2.4 and 2.6? Is it noticeably more powerful? Or is that difference lost in the additional weight of a 280?

And does it sound less appealing? I would imagine having 3 weber carbs sounds better?!

Thanks!

George
 

dcrobbo

Club Member
So was there any feedback on.


"How much are we talking for a LHD to RHD conversion in UK, does anyone know? I also hear its pricier on a 240z as the RHD"
dashboards are rarer?
 

Jay.

Club Member
So was there any feedback on.


"How much are we talking for a LHD to RHD conversion in UK, does anyone know? I also hear its pricier on a 240z as the RHD"
dashboards are rarer?

I was waiting for someone to bite!


This has been discussed multiple times. The cost is hugely dependant on whether you want it to be a perfect RHD conversion (all the LHD to RHD parts swapped) or if you are just after having the steering wheel on the RHS (which requires significantly less parts, work and money). People have done it for <£2k themselves. Some people have been quoted over £10k.
 

dcrobbo

Club Member
Sorry to jump in on this post and I do not wish to upset any forum user's,
I have seen a some of the discussion when I look in the search box on the subject, but do find it hard to pin point exactly what parts you can still purchase, which suppler to use and does any one offer such a service?
 

jonbills

Membership Secretary
Site Administrator
Sorry to jump in on this post and I do not wish to upset any forum user's,
I have seen a some of the discussion when I look in the search box on the subject, but do find it hard to pin point exactly what parts you can still purchase, which suppler to use and does any one offer such a service?
are you asking about WHD to RHD conversion specifically, or parts availability in general?
 

Rob Gaskin

Treasurer
Staff member
Site Administrator
Sorry to jump in on this post and I do not wish to upset any forum user's,
I have seen a some of the discussion when I look in the search box on the subject, but do find it hard to pin point exactly what parts you can still purchase, which suppler to use and does any one offer such a service?

Exactly - it's not easy is it. That's Datsun Z ownership.
 

dcrobbo

Club Member
are you asking about WHD to RHD conversion specifically, or parts availability in general?
Basically as I have been down the route of buying a USA import and still had spend a small fortune making it road worthy for uk roads, I was never happy with it being LHD so I sold it but still miss it.
I cant afford a RHD model so am contemplating buying another newer import 260/280Z and am trying to get my head round whats the very least I would have to do and where to source the parts to convert it to RHD. Not bothered about originality so long as it's solid and has a straight six engine .
 

Bazzateer

Club Member
Might be worth making an offer on one of the three rhd projects on the other thread on here to source all the rhd parts.
 
So was there any feedback on.


"How much are we talking for a LHD to RHD conversion in UK, does anyone know? I also hear its pricier on a 240z as the RHD"
dashboards are rarer?

The dashboards are pot luck, there's some total chancers after £1000+. you see a few sell quickly at the £700ish mark.

Do you need a RHD car? Sensible hats on, the it'll be an expensive conversion, nicely done LHD cars still sell for sensible money, some more so.
 
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