Just bought our first Z (240Z)

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
Glad to be of service ;) You are the young blood from the next generation keeping the marque interest alive so deserve all the help, support and assistance you can get from us old..er timers. Your car is looking good and can vouch for the Mishimoto radiator upgrade as completely worthwhile. I kept mine silver and had to laugh when someone dissed it for not being painted black.

Thanks mate, it's great to have the backup and knowledge base here. Quite amazed how much I've learnt and picked up over the past 2 years and how many people in the community who have helped with my project. Glad to hear that, I think the engine is going to be very grateful of it looking at what's in there now. Lol the more I've thought about it the more I think it will stay as is...

Those carbs look beautiful! Have enjoyed watching the parts come in as you post them too, must be looking forward to fitting them

Ztherapy clearly know their stuff but they do charge for it! It's getting a little silly how many nice parts I now have just sitting here waiting to get on lol. I can't wait to get the car sorted and back on the road again, I think it's going to be a different car again all being well. All in time for the LMC as well I hope.

Where did you get the Mishimoto rad? Love it!

Amazon, £252 is the best price I found anywhere.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mishimoto-...r=8-1&keywords=mishimoto+radiator+datsun+240z
 

uk66fastback

Club Member
Some really nice stuff there - I've been talking to Z Therapy for about three years now about getting mine done - but not polished - I have the new needles from them and the rebuild kit which I have used.

Funnily enough, I'll be soon taking the ali rad OUT of my 240 to put a recored original IN ... ! I bought it from Mike in the US last year and it needs to be installed, as I'm trying to return the car to stock as much as I can!
 

uk66fastback

Club Member
I think it depends on what you want doing ... if you want YOUR carbs doing, then longer, as I think they can do an exchange service - ie you get a pair of SUs back, but not necessarily your ones if you get me.

I don't want mine polished as it'll put everything else in the engine bay to shame.
 

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
How long do Z Therapy take to turn around a pair of carbs ?

You’ll have to chat to Bruce to get an accurate update however I was told three to four months and it ended up being slap bang in the middle of that. My order went in at the end of January. The good thing is that they’ve sent everything over and I just send all of my old kit back to get the core charge refunded once I’ve swapped the parts over. I did get everything done so if you just want the carbs it could be a little quicker.
 

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
Some really nice stuff there - I've been talking to Z Therapy for about three years now about getting mine done - but not polished - I have the new needles from them and the rebuild kit which I have used.

Funnily enough, I'll be soon taking the ali rad OUT of my 240 to put a recored original IN ... ! I bought it from Mike in the US last year and it needs to be installed, as I'm trying to return the car to stock as much as I can!

Thanks, I’m not going to lie it’s been expensive however what they’ve sent does look amazing! I still want triples but argued there wouldn’t be too much to gain on my relatively stock engine for now and I’d have to rechoke and jet later etc.

Haha I completely get it for your car, oem will look much better than ally. I feel as though I can justify it with my build and will likely be grateful of the extra performance down the line even if it doesn’t look like it just left the factory...
 

Woody928

Events Officer
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Club Member
Well hopefully all being well exciting things are about to happen to bring the car back on the road in another revised and much improved state.

Given my lack of engineering skills and knowledge (something I'd love to change and keep endeavoring to) the car is going to Passion Engineering this Saturday for a lot of TLC and primarily to have the R180 3.9 LSD installed, S14 gearbox conversion done and the engine looked at with the new carb setup dialed in. It's safe to say that I'm super excited to have the car back and on the road to make the most of the rest of the summer having only managed to nurse the car to two summer shows and then locked it up in the garage. With the new revised setup it should be able to really attack some B roads and cruise a lot better.

Having thought several times I'd got everything I need over the past several months I've had several issues and hurdles to overcome including last minute items this week which have hopefully now rounded off the list. The biggest issue has been trying to find a good S14 gearbox, it has become abundantly clear that they are is strong demand now with availability going down while prices are going up and the condition of them going down due to the drift scene wrecking them. The gearbox I had stripped by a local workshop was not going anywhere the past few weeks due to the shop repeatedly going back on their word about looking at it week after week, I've therefore had to make alternate arrangements. Last week thanks to Moggy I got in touch with a chap through Facebook who had two gearboxes for sale, in the end I struck a deal and have bought both gearboxes (both of which are meant to be good). We're going to just drop one in and see how it goes after all the issues with trying to get a box rebuilt locally to no avail.

John Palmer kindly acquired a set of S14 internals from Dean's BRE race car which were spare in an attempt to help me have the gearbox rebuilt however the local workshop having spent weeks ignoring me have decided there are slight differences in the gear sets (not sure if there were are any differences between S14 or 14a boxes) and aren't interested in the job. Having now got fed up I've just collected the gearbox in pieces and am storing it in the garage while I work out what to do with it. Not being an expert in any respect but having inspected the gears, this wear that has been mentioned does not seem to be significant and I imagine had I just dropped the box in the car it would have been fine. I suspect the gearbox shop aren't interested in anything that isn't perfect out of fear of any comeback and have just been off with me since day one. Either way I now have two spare gearboxes at the minute albeit one is already spoken for I'll likely keep the stripped box for spares now.

IMG-6582 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

I also need to give a massive shout out to Richie P who has saved the day with my propshaft dilemma. Having not been able to work out what I needed or being aware that my propshaft was inappropriate for shortening coming from an earlier car and therefore not having a slip yoke on one end. By chance Richie had a transitional prop with a slip yoke lying around as a spare which would be ideal to be converted for my conversion. Not only that but he's spent the last few days running around, stripping it back, having it shortened to the correct length for my conversion, repainted and shipped to me ready for the work to be done. In theory I now have a bolt on solution and no more headaches to contend with. Big thank you dude! :bow:

IMG-6589 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

I've also now got my new stub axles to fit the Subaru LSD courtesy of John Williams in the US who is by far the most reasonably priced option for these and was well worth the wait.
IMG-6223 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

I've also decided to stray away from OEM aesthetics for a change, some people will love this and some will hate it however I decided to add some Bosozuku style to my build with this JDM styled shifter knob. I can't wait to see what it looks like installed however I'm confident it will look right at home.
IMG-6583 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

Finally I just want to give a shout out to all of the members of the club who have contributed and helped with my project to date, its amazing how many individuals have contributed to this car in some way and made it a reality when I've come across issues, needed information/advice and sourcing parts etc. Having a great community to support each other makes ownership that much easier and more enjoyable! :thumbs:

Hopefully pictures of a working car are going to be up here imminently.
 

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
Well its been quiet on here for a little while now but there's been lots going on in the background. The car has been and still is in with Iain at Passion Engineering who has been working his magic on bringing the car up to spec, I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for the LMC next week. It's safe to say if everything falls into place then it will be one hell of a road test!

The car has been significantly stripped down to accommodate all of the work, the engine was opened up to check tolerances and make some adjustments when it was noted there was some slack in the timing chain when rotated backwards so it was decided to install a new kit. The broken water pump bolt has been resolved and new carbs installed and adjusted ready for tuning. The new radiator, coolant system filter, rocker cover and hardware will be following shortly. The steering rack lower UJ has been replaced which I'm keeping my fingers crossed will eliminate the play that was previously in the steering to really sharpen up the response with the newly fitted adjustable suspension.

IMG-6760 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

IMG-6759 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

IMG-7008 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

IMG-7007 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

The bulk of the work has been transmission related with several surprises rearing their heads yesterday giving me a bit of a shock and stark reminder of the cars age and unknown history. Below you will see what remains of the clutch pivot pin and the nice 'round' hole that it was located in. Safe to say that was an utter disaster waiting to happen and could have been a mess had we lost the clutch in France or anywhere else for that matter. I've been oblivious to the pending disaster all of this time. I've never been happy with the clutch but assumed it was a worn release bearing causing my trepidation. Fortunately Iain is fabricating a new pivot pin and has completely fixed the mounting hole so it looks factory fresh. His fabrication skills never cease to amaze me and remind me why I don't attempt the bigger jobs at home on the driveway...

IMG-7034 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

IMG-7038 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

IMG-7036 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

Moving onto the gearbox mount itself we were surprised to find it looked nothing like we expected given the age of the car and after some investigation and confirmation from Richie appears to be an automatic transmission gearbox mount. Looking further into it there are no manual mounting points so I'm assuming that the car was more than likely an automatic from the factory that was converted in the US during its lifetime? This being the case I wonder whether the pedal box has also been swapped to accommodate the clutch and center console non original due to the auto transmission shifter? I'd love to hear from the Z aficionados who will likely be able to advise. I believe we are now proceeding with a full custom mount to suit purpose.

IMG-7030 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

There's even silly little things like the new clutch master cylinder rod being too short for unknown reasons causing more work!

IMG-7037 by Mark Woodrow, on Flickr

I can't praise Iain enough at this point for the time he is putting into getting the car finished and most importantly to the very high standards which he works to. I really shouldn't be shocked by some of the things that rear their heads now given all that we've found in the last couple of years but it still does shock me. This is a car with a past that I do not fully understand and would love to know more about. I'm at least now thinking that the car had the gearbox replaced as well as the engine which really makes me want to check the rear diff ratio as well.

It's safe to say it should drive impeccably well when finished, the car will have had all of the suspension, power train and drive train overhauled with very few exceptions. It will be far from the spec that it left Japan with back in September 1970 when it rolled off of the production line.

Hopefully more and positive news to follow very shortly :thumbs:
 

Rob Gaskin

Treasurer
Staff member
Site Administrator
Your write-ups are always interesting in so many ways. Keep them coming please.

After all this work is done you should notice a huge improvement.

Hope you get to Le Mans and back in it - a good shake-down.
 

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
Your write-ups are always interesting in so many ways. Keep them coming please.

After all this work is done you should notice a huge improvement.

Hope you get to Le Mans and back in it - a good shake-down.

Glad your enjoying the updates Rob, its nice to know there's people reading so I'll do my best.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed I don't recognise how the car drives at all, it'll be hard to pinpoint what improvements have improved each area with so many new parts going in at once! Only the brakes left to do to really boost the cars performance further for now, I'm hoping to just enjoy the car for a long time now after this splurge though!

Thanks, me too :thumbs:
 

Albrecht

Well-Known Forum User
Moving onto the gearbox mount itself we were surprised to find it looked nothing like we expected given the age of the car and after some investigation and confirmation from Richie appears to be an automatic transmission gearbox mount. Looking further into it there are no manual mounting points so I'm assuming that the car was more than likely an automatic from the factory that was converted in the US during its lifetime? This being the case I wonder whether the pedal box has also been swapped to accommodate the clutch and center console non original due to the auto transmission shifter? I'd love to hear from the Z aficionados who will likely be able to advise. I believe we are now proceeding with a full custom mount to suit purpose.


That looks like a stock E4100 manual transmission crossmember to me.

What does he mean by "no manual mounting points"?

Remind me, what's the build date of your car again?
Edit: OK, I can see it's a 1971 build. In which case that transmission mount would be the correct factory original type for the car.
Edit 2: So actually a 9/70 build and "1971 Model Year" in US terms?
 
Last edited:

Albrecht

Well-Known Forum User
...the engine was opened up to check tolerances and make some adjustments when it was noted there was some slack in the timing chain when rotated backwards so it was decided to install a new kit.

But why would you rotate it backwards? The cam chain tensioning system is designed to work with the crankshaft 'pulling' the camshaft, which automatically pulls the chain tight between them. There's a guide there to stop any excess 'flapping' of the chain when revs suddenly decrease (off-throttle lag where the crank/cam are momentarily out of synch).

The 'slack' side is where the tensioner and slack side chain guide do their job: The tensioner is mainly oil pressure-driven, so when the engine is not running it's not doing its job fully and is relying on the internal spring to keep the rubber 'shoe' in contact with the chain.

Rotating the engine backwards means that the crank is trying to drive the cam against the tensioner. It doesn't make any sense! OF COURSE there will be slack in the chain when you rotate the engine the wrong way.

No harm fitting a new chain, sprockets, guides and tensioners, but if you turn the engine backwards again after fitting them you'll see exactly the same 'slack' as before - which is normal.
 

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
That looks like a stock E4100 manual transmission crossmember to me.

What does he mean by "no manual mounting points"?

Remind me, what's the build date of your car again?
Edit: OK, I can see it's a 1971 build. In which case that transmission mount would be the correct factory original type for the car.
Edit 2: So actually a 9/70 build and "1971 Model Year" in US terms?

Thank you for stepping in to clarify Alan, I was hoping someone with your knowledge would be able to clarify. My speculation was based upon the below diagram I found, I assumed that from the diagram and other mounts I've seen that all manual transmission mounts bolt onto the chassis horizontally rather than vertically as is the case on my car and also per the automatic transmission mount below.

The car rolled off the productive line 09/1970 (HLS30-10603) so was lead to believe I'd have a different type of mount? I'd be really interested to know more....

latemount2.jpg


With regards to the timing chain that was me having a blonde moment, there was some general slack in the chain (more than expected) causing us to think the tensioner may be showing its age. Not knowing the age of the timing chain or how much mileage it had seen we thought it would be very prudent to change it out while various components were already out of the way access wise. As with everything we've done so far I'm trying to eliminate any possible weak or unknown spots to maximize reliability. Thank you for the extra info, really insightful.
 

Albrecht

Well-Known Forum User
Thank you for stepping in to clarify Alan, I was hoping someone with your knowledge would be able to clarify. My speculation was based upon the below diagram I found, I assumed that from the diagram and other mounts I've seen that all manual transmission mounts bolt onto the chassis horizontally rather than vertically as is the case on my car and also per the automatic transmission mount below.

The car rolled off the productive line 09/1970 (HLS30-10603) so was lead to believe I'd have a different type of mount? I'd be really interested to know more....

latemount2.jpg

I think the key point there is that the Automatics continued using the E4100 style mount after the Manuals had switched to a newer design.

Either way, with your car being a 9/70 HLS30 it would have had the E4100 type mount whether it was Auto or Manual. And being 9/70 production, it would - if indeed it was originally an Auto, and I'm not convinced that it was - it would have been one of the first Auto-equipped HLS30s.

I think this page from the factory parts manuals is most relevant:

 

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
I think the key point there is that the Automatics continued using the E4100 style mount after the Manuals had switched to a newer design.

Either way, with your car being a 9/70 HLS30 it would have had the E4100 type mount whether it was Auto or Manual. And being 9/70 production, it would - if indeed it was originally an Auto, and I'm not convinced that it was - it would have been one of the first Auto-equipped HLS30s.

I think this page from the factory parts manuals is most relevant:


Ahhh ok, thank you for clarifying. That's really interesting to know :thumbs:

I'll throw my wild speculation out of the window then as there are no obvious signs of a conversion either. I think I'm right in saying there is no way of tying the gearbox to the car in terms of serial number to see if its original to the car? It's only the engine and chassis that share those?

Correct 09/70 build, registered in the US in 1971 according to the title.
 

Albrecht

Well-Known Forum User
I'll throw my wild speculation out of the window then as there are no obvious signs of a conversion either. I think I'm right in saying there is no way of tying the gearbox to the car in terms of serial number to see if its original to the car? It's only the engine and chassis that share those?

Unfortunately there's nothing on the car itself code-wise to identify what transmission it left the factory with. The original sales papers of the car would identify it, but you probably don't have those.

However, as there wasn't much variation in the HLS30U (north American market) models - stock spec was either F4W71A 4-speed or (from 9/70-ish on) the 3N71A Auto - it would be one or the other.

What transmission is in it now? If it's a 5-speed B-type it would have been a later private fitment and all bets are off.

Unless you can see any obvious vestigial evidence of Auto to manual conversion, I'd say it was originally F4W71A-equipped and that the crossmember/trans mount is the original E4100 unit it left the factory with.
 

Woody928

Events Officer
Staff member
Club Member
Unfortunately there's nothing on the car itself code-wise to identify what transmission it left the factory with. The original sales papers of the car would identify it, but you probably don't have those.

However, as there wasn't much variation in the HLS30U (north American market) models - stock spec was either F4W71A 4-speed or (from 9/70-ish on) the 3N71A Auto - it would be one or the other.

What transmission is in it now? If it's a 5-speed B-type it would have been a later private fitment and all bets are off.

Unless you can see any obvious vestigial evidence of Auto to manual conversion, I'd say it was originally F4W71A-equipped and that the crossmember/trans mount is the original E4100 unit it left the factory with.

Thanks for confirming, I know I have original manuals however I don't think I've got the sales papers/invoices.

It's got a 4 speed manual fitted which I would assume would be a F4W71A from what your saying, if it was a 5 speed I wouldn't have been so keen to go down the S14 conversion route the way I have. I'm still curious to open up the diff to find out what ratio it was however logic dictates it will be the 3.36.

Good detective work which I agree with, we've found no other signs of a possible conversion. It seems to be the most logical answer that it was a manual as we originally thought with what I now know to be a E4100 mount. Really interesting, thanks :)
 
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